Thread: So, I'm trying out Google's C++ test library...

Just to add my two cents to the language contest side discussion.

Do not think of how the languages were internally designed, think of "what" they are used for and "why" the companies made such a choice.

C:

Embedded programming
Device drivers and kernels
Game Programming (yes, still used but not as much nowadays)
Operating Systems (UNIX anyone)?
Teaching tool in some colleges around the world
Core compiler language for other languages due to the low level features

C++:

Major video game Engine development language (not so much the actual game logic due to scripting)
High level back-end development of websites (Facebook, Google)
Desktop application development (Java/C# seem to overtaking this)
Almost all commercial business applications are heavily coded in C++ (Adobe, Microsoft and most Professional audio software are written exclusively in C++)
Higher level Operating System development

I could go on and on but you get the picture. The test case here is not really about speed, but the language being efficient and the right tool for the job. Would you want to code an entire OS in C++? No. Not because C++ is not capable because with the right development and algorithm in certainly can be done. C has been used for this due to low-level abstractions it allows. On the other hand, I would never use C to code the latest Xbox One game. C "can" be used for this, but again, C++ has been proven to work extremely well with the Game Engine rendering and psychics. Also, Lua is a major scripting language that C++ sits better with. If I threw a toolbox in languages in front of you and asked you to build the next leading enterprise software package - would you choose C or C++? Or Java or even Python? Yes, it's cliche' I know, but it's all about the right tool for the job. Speed only really comes into the equation when people begin looking at bottlenecks in their code. Can a function be executed faster if it was "inline" for example?

Just my two cents.

Ada x

Originally Posted by swgh

Would you want to code an entire OS in C++? No. Not because C++ is not capable because with the right development and algorithm in certainly can be done. C has been used for this due to low-level abstractions it allows.

This is really a non-argument. C++ is a strict superset of C, which means that C is the base class and C++ is the derived class. You can certainly do low-level algorithms in C++, and when you factor in such things as functors or lambdas, they can be ever faster than C. It really depends on how you write the code, of course, but in no sense is C++ inferior to C in this regard. In fact, the whole C++ standard library is written in C++ and it has tons of low-level abstractions and algorithms. And yet, the standard librarry needs to be as fast as possible. C is mostly used for historical reasons, not practical ones*. Unix is C pretty much because Linus Torvalds hates C++, for example.

*) From what I've seen.

You don't have to get rid of it. Neither it will be uninstalled for you with an update.
You can enjoy the tremendous power of powershell for as long as you want. Although, it will be short-lived enough that you'll realize you ejaculated prematurely.

Originally Posted by Yarin

Untrue. C has several features that C++ does not.

Then do please provide examples, so I can look them up.

Originally Posted by MutantJohn

I thought Unix was C because C was this brand new language and it was 1972. Linux was written in C because Linus is an overall troll who loves C. Or does Linus oversee current Unix development as well?

It's true that C++ was not available when Linux was first released. However, in subsequent releases, there has been nothing stopping them from using C++ for some code, as well.

Originally Posted by MutantJohn

One thing I'm wondering about is, what this mean for the Developer Command Prompt for Visual Studio? Is there going to be a Developer PowerShell? I just want CL in my path T_T

The "Developer Command Prompt" shortcut for Visual Studio's purpose is to set environment variables. Notice that it simply calls %VS120COMNTOOLS%\VsDevCmd.bat. To use it in Powershell, you can either call this batch file before starting PowerShell, or you can use Invoke-Environment (mind the outer and inner quotes) from within PowerShell to transfer the environment, e.g.

Code:

PS C:\Users\Me> Invoke-Environment 'call "%VS120COMNTOOLS%\VsDevCmd.bat"'
PS C:\Users\Me> cl hello.cpp
...

Invoke-Environment is discussed on this page: How to call batch script from Powershell? - Stack Overflow

Originally Posted by Yarin

Well... Variable length arrays, Compound literals, Designated initializers, Elysias that can't google, and Type-generic macros, to name a few. Most of these are available to C++ as extensions, though the reversed is true too; GCC lets you really blur the distinction between C & C++.

...So you're going to go into stuff that don't match 1:1 between the languages, the area I decided to skip. It's true that some stuff don't match 1:1, but that doesn't mean C++ can't do it.
- Variable length arrays can be done with std::vector
- Compund literals are supported with initializer lists, e.g.

Code:

MyType T{...};

. You can emulate arrays as initializer_lists, and so on.
- Designated initializers are unfortunately not supported, and the only example you brought up that have no equivalents, but you can create different constructors for this purpose.
- As for Yarins that can't google, well, unfortunately there's just no support for support idiots in the language.
- Templates replace type-generic macros.