Thread: I'm not sure how to title this.

  1. 05-17-2008 #1
    blacksheepnb
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    Question I'm not sure how to title this.

    I'm not sure if this questin really belongs in this section but I feel like I need to ask someone experienced in c++. I'm been a member of this message board for a while, but I've never posted. Any problem I've had has easily been answered by this site or one of the books it suggests. However I have read many of the threads. I've only been trying to learn to program for about 3 weeks, and this site has helped me a lot. I'm just curious how long it takes to actually get a good sense of the language. When I make my own programs I'm still working incredibly slow it seems. I'm repeatedly making mistakes with simple things like pointers ,and functions, though I always do fix them. Even then, the programs I'm creating just seem archaic compared to any I see in this forum. I'm just wondering if I'm working to slow, or expecting results to fast. Sorry if this topic is out of place, or just a stupid question all together.
  2. 05-17-2008 #2
    laserlight
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    I'm just curious how long it takes to actually get a good sense of the language.
    Your mileage may vary, so I'd say that you should not worry about it. Even if you do become proficient in much of C++ (and programming in general), there will always be another new thing to learn that you will take time to become proficient in.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bjarne Stroustrup (2000-10-14)
    I get maybe two dozen requests for help with some sort of programming or design problem every day. Most have more sense than to send me hundreds of lines of code. If they do, I ask them to find the smallest example that exhibits the problem and send me that. Mostly, they then find the error themselves. "Finding the smallest program that demonstrates the error" is a powerful debugging tool.
    Look up a C++ Reference and learn How To Ask Questions The Smart Way
  3. 05-17-2008 #3
    Elysia
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    I agree with laserlight. You will never fully understand everything, but a solid basics is required for Windows programming. How long it takes to reach that level depends on the individual. Some do it fast, some struggle.
    And even when you've reached that level, there is more to learn.
    The more you do, the more you learn. The more experience with pointers, the more familiar you become with them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adak View Post
    io.h certainly IS included in some modern compilers. It is no longer part of the standard for C, but it is nevertheless, included in the very latest Pelles C versions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salem View Post
    You mean it's included as a crutch to help ancient programmers limp along without them having to relearn too much.

    Outside of your DOS world, your header file is meaningless.
  4. 05-17-2008 #4
    robwhit
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    It's normal. The important thing is to know what it is that you know, know what it is that you don't know, and when you don't know, know how to find out.
    Last edited by robwhit; 05-17-2008 at 11:36 AM.
  5. 05-17-2008 #5
    DougDbug
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    My favorite analogy is:

    Quote Originally Posted by DougDbug

    It's like learning to play the guitar... You can learn a few chords in a few days, or a few weeks, but it will be at least a year before you can impress your friends.
    It also depends on if you have any previous programming experience. For most people, C++ is their first programming language and you have to learn programming concepts at the same time you are learning the syntax/structure/features C++ language. Again the same is true with music... If you play one instrument, you already know how to read music, a little about music theory, etc., and it's easier to pick-up a 2nd instrument.

    I didn't take C++ in college, but at the college/university level I'd guess that it takes 2 full semesters to completely cover the standard C++ language. And then, you'd be ready to branch into some special topics and additional libraries (Graphics/GUI, networking/sockets, etc.). It's not really necessary to know that much standard C++ before learning something like GUI programming, but that's the way college is structured, and it does make the more-advanced stuff is easier when you have a solid foundation.
    Last edited by DougDbug; 05-17-2008 at 11:57 AM.
  6. 05-17-2008 #6
    blacksheepnb
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    Well thanks. To be honest I didn't really expect critisim as constructive as this. I'll keep practicing, and hopefully be able to produce something of merit in the near future. BTW I can play play guitar, and while I'm not the best I think I'm alright. However I remember my neighbors telling me to give it up when I first started. (All I played was an acoustic but appartment walls are slim.) Anyways I'm back to the drawing board. I've been wanting to program a texas hold em' odds generator, and I think I'll go ahead and start on it. When I get it finished I'll post it.
  7. 05-18-2008 #7
    medievalelks
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elysia View Post
    I agree with laserlight. You will never fully understand everything, but a solid basics is required for Windows programming. How long it takes to reach that level depends on the individual
    The OP didn't mention anything about Windows programming, so I'm not sure why that is relevant. In fact, if one was just starting out in Windows programming, I'd strongly suggest learning C# and .NET instead.
  8. 05-18-2008 #8
    Elysia
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    It's simply relevant because GUI programming is an immediate step in C++, as it requires a programmer to have previous experience.
    And though the OP may not have mentioned it, perhaps the day shall come when it is time.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adak View Post
    io.h certainly IS included in some modern compilers. It is no longer part of the standard for C, but it is nevertheless, included in the very latest Pelles C versions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salem View Post
    You mean it's included as a crutch to help ancient programmers limp along without them having to relearn too much.

    Outside of your DOS world, your header file is meaningless.
  9. 05-18-2008 #9
    medievalelks
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elysia View Post
    It's simply relevant because GUI programming is an immediate step in C++, as it requires a programmer to have previous experience.
    Huh? Why GUI moreso than multithreaded servers, or graphics, or embedded software, etc.? And if Windows GUI programming is indeed the target, C# and .NET would be the path to take at this point.
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