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FloatingPoint
07-18-2003, 09:52 AM
Just would like have the general idea how you guys cope w/ your learning all those languages.

I'm thinking of starting learning Java and I'm currently on C++, but not quite sure if I shouldn't begin until I'm halfway thru or something. I'm also trying to understand a bit of PHP.

BTW, what do I need to learn Java? Will I have to d/load a compiler for Java? For C++ I'm using Dev C++ 4 and it's great IMO.

RoD
07-18-2003, 09:56 AM
I studied VB and Ultima Online scripting at once, now im doing C++ and J# among other things i am trying.

joshdick
07-18-2003, 10:29 AM
Twenty seven. If you're not learning at least twenty three languages at once, you're doing something wrong.












Seriously though, learning a language is such an ongoing process that I don't think one can ever reach a point at which one can just say, "Yep, I know everything there is to know about that language so I can just stop learning anything about it." So, I think one is obligated to learn more than one language at once.

I do think, however, that it's good to get a firm grasp on at least one language when you begin to program. Then, when you try to learn another language, little will seem all that new to you. You'll just look at something in language X and go, "Oh, that's just like this in language Y."

And that's my two cents.

Zach L.
07-18-2003, 10:35 AM
True, but the learning curve is a lot steeper at the beginning. There comes a point when learning new things in the language become relatively few and far between.

At any rate, I would not enter the "steep learning curve" part of multiple languages that are particularly dissimilar (C++ and Prolog, for example). Perhaps a couple similar languages at the same time is manageable.

FloatingPoint
07-18-2003, 10:37 AM
Originally posted by Zach L.
Perhaps a couple similar languages at the same time is manageable.

Yea, I guess that suits me too :D

Ben_Robotics
07-18-2003, 12:56 PM
well,
Im tryin' to learn Spanish and German at the same time and so far so good!

confuted
07-18-2003, 01:26 PM
I've done two or three at a time, but it's important to stagger them by a few months. I need to learn Java for AP comp sci next year, and I would like to learn PHP or Perl (does anyone know where I can get some free web space that will let me play with those?)

Mister C
07-18-2003, 05:01 PM
BTW, what do I need to learn Java? Will I have to d/load a compiler for Java? For C++ I'm using Dev C++ 4 and it's great IMO.



Well do you want to use the command line or an IDE? Check out java.sun.com.





I studied VB and Ultima Online scripting at once, now im doing C++ and J# among other things i am trying.


I would not waste my time with J#. There are many professional articles and websites including javaranch.com that have had this debate. I would either use C# or pure Java.

Perspective
07-18-2003, 05:05 PM
The important thing is to learn the basic concepts of programming. Applying these concepts to new languages is just a matter of learning new syntax :o and learning the oddities of the language.

FloatingPoint
07-19-2003, 07:08 AM
Originally posted by blackrat364
I've done two or three at a time, but it's important to stagger them by a few months. I need to learn Java for AP comp sci next year, and I would like to learn PHP or Perl (does anyone know where I can get some free web space that will let me play with those?)

You dont need free web space to have PHP and/or Perl. Just d/load the necessary bin or modules for your platform, i.e. if you're using Linux or Windows. You'll also need a web server, Apache or IIS would do fine on either platform. Next is a lil configuration to get both the web server and the web application server working.

confuted
07-19-2003, 09:29 AM
I've tried many times for many hours to get a webserver running on my computer, but for some reason, I can't configure my router to allow it. Is it possible to run PHP/Perl stuff entirely locally, without reliance on an internet connection at all?

FloatingPoint
07-19-2003, 09:52 AM
Certainly!

Just install the server software, IIS or Apache and you'll only need to http to your own pc, i.e. that is the localhost.

http://localhost or http://127.0.0.1 or the name of your pc, like http://powerzone

I'm not familiar w/ setting up a webserver when you have a router, but I guess it only needs to be configured if you want other ppl outside to have access to your server.

tgm
07-20-2003, 01:17 AM
The most languages I've ever studied in the same semester was 6. I was learning Java, Perl, Bash shell scripting, VBScript, Lisp and Ada. Ofcourse I had already learned plenty of C and C++ before, so picking up the syntax wasn't that bad (Lisp was interesting though). The hard part was keeping them all separate for the exams.
Now I mostly program in Java and VBScript with a little C++ here and there. And I've recently picked up Perl again.

blackrat364 -
If you need any help setting up a local server I can give you tips and links to get you up and running. Just let me know what OS and server you're using.
You should be able to setup an Apache server with PHP and Perl support on Windows or Unix/Linux with little effort.
And if you want help configuring your router so you can get to it from the internet I can help you there too. I'd suggest a dynamic DNS host like www.no-ip.com unless you have a static IP.

confuted
07-20-2003, 02:54 AM
while my IP isn't technically static, it hasn't changed since I've had the modem, so that's good enough for me :)

lightatdawn
07-20-2003, 09:06 AM
>>The important thing is to learn the basic concepts of programming.

Exactly. I would safely say: You know C? You know Java. And J#, J++, C#, blah blah K^% and F@* etc etc. You'd pick up Pascal in about 2.3 seconds (use Delphi). Not that you really need pascal for anything IMO. You learn one scripting language you learn 'em all. Many are based off the C syntax as well so that makes 'em twice as easy.

Personally I dont go around learning everything just for the sake of it. I know every language I've ever had a use for. I keep increasing my abilities in the languages I use (language really: C++). I've taught people languages I'd never seen before in my life. Sat down and looked at my brothers Python script and debugged it without every having read a line of Python before.

Understand the whys and all the different hows become apparent.

FloatingPoint
07-20-2003, 10:26 AM
Ok, I'm concentrating on C++ now...concentrate, concentrate :D

Ben_Robotics
07-20-2003, 07:13 PM
try learning assembly with C or java. they really come along together well!

confuted
07-20-2003, 07:17 PM
Yeah, I agree with what lightatdawn said. I don't know if you were around/saw the "hacking challenge" from a month or so ago (there's a thread on GD if you're interested - it's completely legal). Anyway, I'd never written nor read a line of Java or Javascript before, but I made it all the way through that challenge (with the exception of one which we brute forced as a group and another that I couldn't get). It involved reading/modifying a lot of Java code. Once you learn C++ well, other languages become... simple.

Lynux-Penguin
07-20-2003, 08:41 PM
Umm, well hehe
Learning languages at once, I think I might have a say in this. Not just COMP Languages.

This YEAR:
Learned Ruby, Lisp, more ASM (x86) and more Perl
But that's just a little Comp Languages
I also have learned Spanish to the degree I can speak around in Mexico. I have taught myself Japanese to the point where I can understand everything I see on my Japanese Television and I am going to take a trip there soon.
Note: I have not taken a single class for any of these except Spanish. (Got to spanish 2 and stopped)

If you want any advice on cramming a language and becoming fluuent in about 2 years email me. Note: EXTREMELY Difficult.

For any language, Comp or Not, one thing is required: DESIRE.
I learned C when I was 12, C++ when I was 13. Basic when I was 14 (and laughed). CalcBasic when I was 7. BrainF*** last year. Perl was a long time ago. Pascal have not learned yet, neither for Fortran.

My favorite language (comp) is C for the power of the language.
My Favorite language to speak is either English or Japanes. I use a lot of both now...

-LC

confuted
07-20-2003, 08:47 PM
BrainF*** definitely lives up to its name. Geeze, that language amazes me. Did you program anything useful/cool?

bookworm
07-22-2003, 10:36 PM
This is wat I did in the last 3 years-
First learn HTML
Then learnt JAVA,XML,CGI together
Then learnt C++
Right now,I'm studying VB.net as a part of my hobby,like the one's above and C since its a part of my syllabus.I think I've forgotten a bit of JAVA and CGI,but the rest are still sorta fresh.

BTW,RoD,how do u find J#?Many advised me not to go for it since MS won't take it seriously.But I like the concept of it,since it has its own compact runtime.But I'll certainly stick to only Windows forms and Windows services with VB.net.I think it a better idea to work with HTML,XML,Java,CGI on the web rather than asp.net.

VirtualAce
07-23-2003, 06:39 AM
Here is my progression thus far:

QBasic
VBDOS (useless)
C
C++
Assembler - TASM,MASM,NASM - not nasty AT&T crap
Visual Basic (not my favorite)
Some Java - although IMO it sucks, so I quit work on it


Out of all of the above the one that gave me the best understanding of what the **** is going on under all of the code is assembler. Granted its not used much anymore and it is not portable and blah, blah, blah ....I've heard it all. But it does give you a very good understanding of how it all fits together and I believe even a basic knowledge of assembler will make you a better programmer. If you can understand assembly - then you can understand any language - just as if you understand C, you can understand pretty much any scripting language.

Don't learn assembler for the sake of its usefulness in future apps - learn it for the sake of understanding what is going on underneath the surface. Even helps in Windows code - although it is true you can defeat yourself with optimized compilers. But overall I would recommend having a basic knowledge of some assembler - other languages then become a snap. That's what really made it all 'click' for me. Just my opinion.

Terrance
07-25-2003, 07:09 PM
My opinion is to learn C first. Then move onto java/c#, or c++.

Don't bother learning more than one language at a time, unless there's a reason for you to do so.

Once you learn C, you'll have a fundamental understanding of C++ and java, minus the object oriented aspects of the languages.

Kinasz
07-25-2003, 07:49 PM
I tried to learn c and java at the same time when i first started coding, your right about the learning curve!