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Golden Bunny
06-12-2002, 08:06 PM
I know I shouldn't be talking about this at a time like this, on a web site like this. But it must be said. The ozone layer is being destroyed, the future of mankind will be non-existent if we don't do anything about it. The fuel from cars are one of the causes of the ozone layer being destroyed by the day. The ozone layer is extremely important. Its a layer(in the sky) that obsorb ultra-violent radiation from the sun. Without it, the majority of humans on earth will die of skin cancer(or be like Michael Jackson, "You Rock my world!!"). Thats why its important that you people drive electric automobiles instead of regular cars. The majority of Japanese civilians ride their bike to work, which is a very smart move. The destruction of the ozone later isn't the only conflict that places human existence into jeoperdy. The destruction of the rain forest, global warming, the green house effect. Wait a minute, all of these would be caused if the ozone layer never existed......my fault. Its important to have environmental awareness. So don't sit in biology or Global History class saying, "Why do I need to learn this?", "This is not important!!", well it is. Education is a must. The more you know, the more powerful you are. Americans tend to worship money and view money as their only god, their only hope, their only answer to problems(what happens if you run out?). So I just wanted you guys to know that environmental awareness is important. Thats all.

Sentaku senshi
06-12-2002, 09:06 PM
>)Thats why its important that you people drive electric automobiles instead of regular cars. The majority of Japanese civilians ride their bike to work, which is a very smart move. <

At this current time electric cars are only realisticly good for those who don't need to travel long distence such as that live in or around a city.

A hi-bride gas/electric car is also limieted by its price and the fact there are only a few designs of cars that have this available.

In a few more years or at least when we run out of oil we will have made more advances and fuel cells will be in all cars.

Bikes are even more limited.

Golden Bunny
06-12-2002, 09:20 PM
how are bikes limited?
Some Japanese civilians go to work everyday on using bikes. Some of them don't even live near their jobs!!

novacain
06-12-2002, 11:21 PM
>>At this current time electric cars are only realisticly good for those who don't need to travel long distence such as that live in or around a city.

I think it is ford who are conduting a trial on electric cars at present in the US. Only have limited range but normal speed. More expensive than normal but recharge for much less (curently free to recharge in trial and have available parking spots to do it!).

adrianxw
06-13-2002, 01:05 AM
Unless you are using solar cells or similar, (not practical), the electricity used to recharge the vehicle must be generated somewhere, and today that means largely a fossil fuelled or nuclear station. You simply move the pollution source from the car to the generating station. I would agree however, that emisions from generating stations are easier to control because they are static and one can use some heavy gear to clean up the exhaust which would be impractical in car.

I don't have figures to hand on the relative efficiencies of the two systems, but when energy is transformed, there are inevitable losses. Converting the fuel to motion in a car, or converting the fuel to electricity, then transmitting that electricity, then transforming it back into motion - makes you wonder.

-KEN-
06-13-2002, 10:29 AM
And anyway, it'd have to be a slow transition to electric in order to work. Think of the shock our economy would be in if everyone stoppped buying fuel and got themselves electric cars.

DISGUISED
06-13-2002, 10:43 AM
I have a friend that took one of those Honda Hybrids for a test drive. I guess they got about two blocks when it caught on fire and burned to the ground in a bank parking lot.

adrianxw
06-13-2002, 01:13 PM
>>> when it caught on fire and burned to the ground in a bank parking lot.

So did he buy one?

;)

Unregistered
06-13-2002, 01:15 PM
.

-KEN-
06-13-2002, 01:23 PM
What's this? The fifth thread you've done that on? Get a life. Find some friends. Go outside.

adrianxw
06-13-2002, 01:28 PM
>>> ,,|,,

Do the administrators at Foothill - De Anza college know you are using their machines to abuse public forums?

Aran
06-13-2002, 01:31 PM
Originally posted by Golden Bunny
The ozone layer is extremely important. Its a layer(in the sky) that obsorb ultra-violent radiation from the sun. Without it, the majority of humans on earth will die of skin cancer

ultra-violent radiation.

that's the coolest misspelling of ultra-violet radiation i've EVER seen.

Shiro
06-13-2002, 01:33 PM
>Some Japanese civilians go to work everyday on using bikes.
>Some of them don't even live near their jobs!!

I'm using my car to get to work, my work is 80 km away. Using a bike it would take hours to get to my work and if I have to go to a building in a different city, I would be more cycling than working. Not that it is bad, but my boss won't pay me for cycling. :)

Anyway, I think there should be also better bus connections and more train stations, at least in my country. If there was a train going from where I live to the office, then I would use it. A hundred people going by train is much cleaner than hundred cars or perhaps even 25 cars if people go car-pooling.

VW has invented a car which uses 1 liter/100 km.

http://www.news24.com/News24/Wheels24/News/0,3999,2-15-47_1168834,00.html

Also there are experiments with cars running on water, but not very succesful yet. Though there are some prototypes of cars which use water.

I think the large energy companies, oil- and gas companies, will be prepared to this new developments. But I wonder how the oil-producing countries will react. Take for example the middle-east, the countries there produce a lot of oil which is currently used as fuel and for other things. If oil isn't needed anymore for fuel, the need for oil wil decrease. I don't know a lot of economics, but I remember that if the need for oil decreases, also the prices will decrease. Anyway, I'm very curious to see how those oil-producing countries will react.

Sentaku senshi
06-13-2002, 02:58 PM
Originally posted by adrianxw
Unless you are using solar cells or similar, (not practical), the electricity used to recharge the vehicle must be generated somewhere, and today that means largely a fossil fuelled or nuclear station. You simply move the pollution source from the car to the generating station. I would agree however, that emisions from generating stations are easier to control because they are static and one can use some heavy gear to clean up the exhaust which would be impractical in car.


Fuel cells will be used to power electitric cars by 2005 if all goes well
Damiler chryster (http://www.enn.com/news/enn-stories/1999/03/031899/necar4_2203.asp) and Ford (http://www.howstuffworks.com/news-item10.htm) have both anonced plans for fuel cell cars in 2004.

Aran
06-13-2002, 03:55 PM
Originally posted by Golden Bunny
how are bikes limited?
Some Japanese civilians go to work everyday on using bikes. Some of them don't even live near their jobs!!

bikes are only usefulll if you live in the city and work in the city.

Otherwise, the commute would be much more than a feasible distance and the time it would take to comute via bike would be way too long.

ygfperson
06-13-2002, 04:03 PM
the ozone layer isn't being destroyed by our cars. that's global warming. the ozone layer is being destroyed because of cfc's, a refridgerant discontinued everywhere years ago. unfortunately some still use products made with cfc's; and the cfc's in the atmosphere now still cause damage. it's a chain reaction.

golfinguy4
06-13-2002, 06:16 PM
Originally posted by Shiro
>Some Japanese civilians go to work everyday on using bikes.
>Some of them don't even live near their jobs!!

I'm using my car to get to work, my work is 80 km away. Using a bike it would take hours to get to my work and if I have to go to a building in a different city, I would be more cycling than working. Not that it is bad, but my boss won't pay me for cycling. :)

Anyway, I think there should be also better bus connections and more train stations, at least in my country. If there was a train going from where I live to the office, then I would use it. A hundred people going by train is much cleaner than hundred cars or perhaps even 25 cars if people go car-pooling.

VW has invented a car which uses 1 liter/100 km.

http://www.news24.com/News24/Wheels24/News/0,3999,2-15-47_1168834,00.html

Also there are experiments with cars running on water, but not very succesful yet. Though there are some prototypes of cars which use water.

I think the large energy companies, oil- and gas companies, will be prepared to this new developments. But I wonder how the oil-producing countries will react. Take for example the middle-east, the countries there produce a lot of oil which is currently used as fuel and for other things. If oil isn't needed anymore for fuel, the need for oil wil decrease. I don't know a lot of economics, but I remember that if the need for oil decreases, also the prices will decrease. Anyway, I'm very curious to see how those oil-producing countries will react.

Shiro, do the cars run on water? I thought they used hydrogen fuel cells and the waste was water. I'm probably wrong, o well.

golfinguy4
06-13-2002, 06:19 PM
ygf is right. It is the cfc's. They take an oxygen atom from a split oxygen molecule. Hence, the ozone(O3) cannot form because the extra oxygen atom is not there. The real kicker is that the process continues, and the chlorine(I think) stays up there for a while continuing the cycle of taking the oxygen atom.

Dual-Catfish
06-13-2002, 06:37 PM
I don't worry myself over such issues, I'll be long dead before the ozone layer ever affects mankind.

Hillbillie
06-13-2002, 07:00 PM
Here are some links that may be of interest to you.

http://www.fuelandfiber.com/Fuel/fuel.html
http://www.equalrights4all.org/bach/Fuel.html
http://www-unix.oit.umass.edu/~verdant/Marijuana_FAQ/X0014_5a_How_can_hemp_be_u.html
http://www-unix.oit.umass.edu/~verdant/Marijuana_FAQ/X0014_5a_How_can_hemp_be_u.html
http://www.geocities.com/capitolhill/lobby/8342/fuel.html
http://www.unclenicks.net/tchi/COMMERCIAL/Fuel/fuel.html
http://www.artistictreasure.com/learnmorecleanair.html

I guess I could go on, but that should be enough. :)

Golden Bunny
06-13-2002, 08:36 PM
I"m not surprised.

Aran replies only to bash me and make me look stupid. What the hell, how could you guys worship this Aran character?! I didn't do anything wrong.

Sentaku senshi
06-13-2002, 08:41 PM
Golden Bunney were is Aran trying to bash you in this thread. You might be interperting what he wrote in a wrong way.

Golden Bunny
06-13-2002, 08:44 PM
it doesn't seem like bashing to you guy but he does it to get me angry. He does it on AIM alot on purpose, first page.

Hillbillie
06-13-2002, 09:29 PM
> Aran replies only to bash me and make me look stupid. What the hell, how could you guys worship this Aran character?! I didn't do anything wrong.<

I don't worship Aran. Frankly, I hate the bastard! :p ;)

Anyway, I'm sure Aran doesn't bash you. He's got sort of a blunt dry sarcasm (reminds me of Daria, ah, remember that show?), and that's one of the reasons we all like him.

Govtcheez
06-13-2002, 11:25 PM
> What the hell, how could you guys worship this Aran character?! I didn't do anything wrong.

Well, I know I worship him. Anus is my hero!

Anyways - he's right. Ozone or not, there's not way I could ride my bike 45 miles to work everyday. I'd have to leave my house at 3 in the morning.

And like... somebody... said, IF electric, hybrids, or fuel cell cars are adopted, it's not gonna be for awhile. It would kick the hell out of the economy, plus the oil companies have more than enough cash to make sure none of that happens for a long, long time.

(I have to stop making posts after partying.... It's way too hard to think straight)

adrianxw
06-14-2002, 12:22 AM
Sentaku senshi:

>>> Fuel cells will be used to power electitric cars by 2005

I am very well aware of fuel cell technology, however, the most efficient fuel cells use Hydrogen as fuel, Hydrogen is, (largely), made by electrolysis of water, which uses a lot of electricity, which has to be generated somewhere so once again...

>>> You simply move the pollution source from the car to the generating station.

novacain
06-14-2002, 01:49 AM
We are introducing the solar powered BBQ in our national parks, at US$25,000 each. Where else would that be a priority?! Power stored in battery for night time and solar panel acts as a roof / shade.

Can't use wood as fire hazard. Gas BBQ + Beer + Idiot = BANG! (not that we are running low on idiots but the waste of beer is disturbing us)

Govtcheez
06-14-2002, 08:18 AM
> We are introducing the solar powered BBQ in our national parks, at US$25,000 each.

That sounds pretty neat - do you have a link or something where there's a pic or info?

Shiro
06-14-2002, 09:32 AM
>Shiro, do the cars run on water? I thought they used hydrogen
>fuel cells and the waste was water. I'm probably wrong, o well.

You may be right, I don't know the correct English translation.