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golfinguy4
03-11-2002, 08:06 PM
I am curious to see how the response to this goes. Normally, religion ones cause a big stir so lets see what political ones do.

gnu-ehacks
03-11-2002, 08:20 PM
I consider myself conservative.

ygfperson
03-11-2002, 08:33 PM
liberal-moderate here

golfinguy4
03-11-2002, 08:40 PM
I'm liberal/moderate.

novacain
03-11-2002, 10:10 PM
Is voting compusory where you live?

Do you vote if it is not?
(approx US$25 fine in Aust for not voting)

ygfperson
03-11-2002, 10:18 PM
in the us it's totally optional. i haven't voted because i'm underage.

doubleanti
03-11-2002, 10:19 PM
i'm not sure about the whole of the united states, but in california, 18 percent of the population make decisions for themselves, and the other 88 percent... for shame... [i actually think a penalty for not voting might be beneficial, unless they get some sort of waiver y'know... wow i wouldn't have thought that penalties existed, what a world we live in... far away from home...]

Yoshi
03-11-2002, 11:38 PM
im4 socialists... where is it?

Niy
03-12-2002, 12:18 AM
Communist here!
No such option?

Govtcheez
03-12-2002, 07:41 AM
I'm a pinko liberal. I predict this thread tanks within 10 more posts.

ober
03-12-2002, 07:59 AM
Originally posted by Govtcheez
I predict this thread tanks within 10 more posts.

I agree... although I'm really surprised this hasn't sparked a discussion on religion or something equally intruiging like how monkeys will rule the world someday...

conservative/republican here... (get over it)..

Barjor
03-12-2002, 09:17 AM
Socialist, but we don't have that in USA so I would have to say Nader

Govtcheez
03-12-2002, 09:24 AM
> 18 percent of the population make decisions for themselves, and the other 88 percent...

Hold up a sec - I know California's a big state, but... :D

ygfperson
03-12-2002, 12:43 PM
we had a socialist choice. the guy's name was harry browne :p

Deckard
03-12-2002, 12:50 PM
Originally posted by ygfperson
we had a socialist choice. the guy's name was harry browne :p I blame his parents for naming him after adjectives.

ygfperson
03-12-2002, 01:23 PM
sigh...we really need a sarcasm tag... i was being sarcastic... but harry browne was a real presidential canidate... saw him on c-span... "end this insane war on drugs"

Govtcheez
03-12-2002, 01:26 PM
> "end this insane war on drugs"

Cool, a dirty hippie (I'm going to see how many people I can offend in this thread... It seems like a good place to do it)

Deckard
03-12-2002, 01:46 PM
Originally posted by ygfperson
sigh...we really need a sarcasm tag... i was being sarcastic...I was also being sarcastic. I guess we really do need a sarcasm tag :)

ygfperson
03-12-2002, 03:22 PM
he's a libertarian. (aka a republican anarchist)

Cruxus
03-12-2002, 04:29 PM
I don't particularly like any of the political parties available right now, though, come November, I will probably vote for more Democrats than Republicans. I would consider myself independent moderate with, maybe, slightly liberal leanings. I am definitely opposed to the sharp social conservatism of most elected officials of the Republican party and oppose such things as school prayer (although not school vouchers) and increased government censorship; the Democratic party upsets me here, too: I am opposed to affirmative action because I am opposed to regarding racial, ethnic, religious, and gender for employment and applicability; oppurtunity should be by merit, not race.

I consider forcing citizens to vote to be just as bad as not voting when it is optional--if not worse. Freedom includes the freedom to abstain.

For those of you who said communism seriously, why would you choose communism?

golfinguy4
03-12-2002, 08:28 PM
A) Communism is one of the BEST governments in principle; however, it provides no incentive to work hard so it will never work.


B) A lot of people believe the way you do Cruxus. The only problem is that none of them are rich enough to run or have the political background to be successful. Sad, isn't it??

whistlenm1
03-12-2002, 08:42 PM
Independant because it depends on the issue, I could vote liberal or conservative.

Xterria
03-12-2002, 08:47 PM
Democratic people are too soft...consider this
if we had gore for president and september 11th occured then what do you think would've happened? I bet gore just would of sat on his butt saying 'we'll get you!!!! someday....' and if china sent nukes at us i bet he wouldn't even have a nuclear defense and wouldn't even fire back to make the world a better place. I bet in this time of 'crisis' *ack* gore wouldn't do much. The taliban would still exist.
I'm republican and proud

golfinguy4
03-12-2002, 08:55 PM
And 12, so how do u know what u r talkin about!!!!! JK:D

gnu-ehacks
03-12-2002, 08:59 PM
Xterria...People your age shouldn't talk. Wait, that's being discriminate, just you shouldn't talk.

First of all I'm a Republican. Second of all, Democrats and Republicans both rallied behind Bush. Third of all, Gore shouldn't have been representing Democrats. Third of all, China won't nuke us, because we are basically in control of the economy...Inidirectly.

Xterria
03-12-2002, 09:47 PM
dude you have something aganst me...i've known it for a long time

novacain
03-12-2002, 10:20 PM
Cruxus
>>I consider forcing citizens to vote to be just as bad as not voting when it is optional--if not worse. Freedom includes the freedom to abstain.

If you old enough to vote did you vote last election?

gnu-ehacks
03-12-2002, 10:29 PM
lol...do i? :D

tim545666
03-12-2002, 10:32 PM
I think that pretty much every government sucks. Democracy sucks because most people are stupid. A republic is like a democracy, just more corrupt. In theory, communism works but in real life it fails and turns into a dictatorship where the dictator takes advantage of his people. Anarchy doesn't provide protection for the people. Monarchies don't work because you're screwed when you get an idiot into the throne. The BEST in theory is an enlightened monarch, but that's a hypocritical statement.
So choose one. I think democracy is the lesser of all these evils. Oh yeah I forgot socialism. It sucks cuz its inefficient.

gnu-ehacks
03-12-2002, 10:33 PM
okay, i will try to be nicer xterria. :D

shtarker
03-12-2002, 10:58 PM
>>okay, i will try to be nicer xterria.

Why bother? He's practically asking for a nuclear war. Developing nuclear weapons is the stupidest thing imaginable, especially at this point in history.

gnu-ehacks
03-12-2002, 11:24 PM
So if we are nuked, we just sit around?

Deckard
03-13-2002, 06:30 AM
Originally posted by tim545666
Democracy sucks because most people are stupid.Democracy sucks because the power doesn't really lie with the people. The only things we get to vote for are political office and local referendums (not the nationwide issues that affect us the most).

Our style of government was undoubtedly useful when a letter took weeks to get from the east coast to the west coast (and then a few more weeks for the response to arrive). I would welcome a constitutional change that replaced (or severly curtailed the power of) the legislative branch and replaced it with annual or semi-annual nationwide voting.

There would be a number of issues to work out, such as who gets to pick which bills are voted on and how to handle 'emergency topics' that shouldn't wait for the next (semi) annual vote.

Dalren
03-13-2002, 04:01 PM
Other, The republicans are to authoritarian, the gov't doesnt have any right to control my actions that dont harm others. The democrats, are to socialist/communist in their economic policies, the money i earn should not go to those who dont make much.

Communism is the root of evil, the idea that what i produce should go to others who produce nothing, is simply wrong. Read anything by ayn rand, if your still socialist after that well then nothing can help you.

Brian
03-13-2002, 04:25 PM
Originally posted by gnu-ehacks
So if we are nuked, we just sit around?

Why? What should we do? Shooting back would be killing hundreds of innocents, and would also be sinking to their level.

Revenge is not good.

Xterria
03-13-2002, 05:08 PM
I never said that we should make more nukes, i said a nuclear defense. We have more than 10 other countrys who would nuke us if they had the chance. like libya and iraq, who already have nukes...

-KEN-
03-13-2002, 05:29 PM
>>Communism is the root of evil, the idea that what i produce should go to others who produce nothing, is simply wrong. Read anything by ayn rand, if your still socialist after that well then nothing can help you.<<

Argx, do you actually know anything of communism? I'm not really pro-communism, but it's surely utopian in its ideals. Everyone (read: everyone) works hard, and the money is divided evenly among the people. It's truly a shame that we're too greedy to have it ever work.

Barjor
03-13-2002, 05:35 PM
Originally posted by Xterria

I'm republican and proud
That fits so well with your image as a spolied overprotected brat.

incognito
03-13-2002, 05:37 PM
Communism is perfect in theory but it has yet to be proven to work. I think, my personal opinion and I am certain that others agree with me, the problem with communism is incentive. If there was some kind of incentive in communism people would work harder and better. If you work your ass off, and the guy next door to you does a half assed job, and you still get the same benefits.....you might think "hey what the heck, why not do the same thing he's doing, I would still get the same benefits."

incognito
03-13-2002, 05:39 PM
Note: I would rather stick to Democracy......this has been proven to work. Rule by the people......pretty cool if you ask me.

Barjor
03-13-2002, 05:40 PM
Comunism is great on paper but the theory is beaten by the fact that humans are born to be as lazy as possible. Really to bad

incognito
03-13-2002, 05:44 PM
...that humans are born to be as lazy as possible.




Not necessarily true, you're generalizing.

Barjor
03-13-2002, 05:45 PM
O yes I do..Makes the debate easier

gnu-ehacks
03-13-2002, 08:43 PM
You know, technically, America is a Republic...Not a Democracy.

Dalren
03-13-2002, 08:49 PM
Yes i do know something of communism, I have even read the communist manifesto.


Originally posted by -Ken-
Everyone (read: everyone) works hard, and the money is divided evenly among the people.

This is exactly what I am against. Why should what I earn/produce (money, food, etc...) be divided amongst everyone else. If I perfect cold fusion, or propetual motion, why should I only get as much as someone who is only qualified to serve food at mcdonalds. The marxist idea that people should be paid by need rather than ability, is to put it simply, evil. If wanting to keep what I earn, or produce, makes me a greedy materialst, well than Im a greedy materialist.

As I was proof-reading this I decided i should justify my calling communism evil. A governments first duty is to protect the natural rights of its citizens, this is its key moral obligation. Look at the societies we call immoral, more often than not it is because of terrible human rights violations. Communism fails to uphold the natrual right to property. In communism the government takes all the property through the governments monopoly on force. Therefore Communism is immoral, as it fails to uphold the natural rights of its citizens.

golfinguy4
03-13-2002, 08:49 PM
Please explain.

Dalren
03-13-2002, 08:50 PM
In the USA we elect people to represent us, since it is not practical to have the entire population vote on every issue. So its technicly a republic, or representitive democracy

novacain
03-13-2002, 08:51 PM
>>like libya and iraq, who already have nukes...

No they don't.

>>America is a Republic...Not a Democracy.

Republic being a subset of democracy.

Xterria
03-13-2002, 08:55 PM
libya's goverment does have nukes, but not many...its in the latest issue of time magasine, and iraq, constantly trying to get checked by the un, probably does have them, just concealed unground somewhere like in the movies:p

Dalren
03-13-2002, 09:01 PM
I havent heard anything about libya having nukes, although it is possible that i missed something about it. Same thing with iraq, but its one thing to have nukes, or bio/chem weapons, it another thing to have a delivery method. Yeah N. Korea has nukes but they dont have a way to hit the USA (not even Hawaii), and its even harder to shrink a nuke down to use as some sort of suitcase terrorist weapon.