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incognito
03-10-2002, 12:03 PM
Well we all know that VB is not the fastest and most professional like of the computer languages...but it gets the job done quick and easier....although I hear is kinda slow.....but you "code" it faster. Sometimes I like to think of VB as the AOL of computer languages......My question is do you think it's worth it to learn VB after someone has already learned C++ and Win32.........Note: I have not yet learned C++ nor Win32........But I'm working it on it. :D

Prelude
03-10-2002, 12:10 PM
>I like to think of VB as the AOL of computer languages
I like that, it's so true :)

But seriously, VB is something you want to learn because it's actually used more than C for simpler applications and GUI overlays for C or C++ processing. It's a trade-off, use C or C++ for everything and get better efficiency with more work, or get a less efficient GUI that is much easier and faster to create so that you can concentrate on the C/C++ processing.

-Prelude

Sorensen
03-10-2002, 12:11 PM
If you want a language to do RAD on win32, and you already know C++, it may be worth looking into C# rather than VB.

Brian
03-10-2002, 12:12 PM
VB is the AOL of computer languages?

So it charges for endless engaged signals, sells your information to telemarketing and doesn't let you connect normally and doesnt let you cancel your account?

VB isn't sounding very good.

Prelude
03-10-2002, 12:19 PM
>VB isn't sounding very good
Visual BASIC. Just because a modern and cool sounding keyword like visual is used doesn't mean that it isn't still BASIC ;)

>it may be worth looking into C#
I agree, I've been hearing good things about Windows Forms with C#.

-Prelude

ggs
03-10-2002, 12:48 PM
If you have the coin, you might as well stick with a product like Borland C++ Builder. But your future employers will likely have something else to say about that...

As an aside, I'm currently taking a "Computer Science" course in highschool, and of course it uses visual basic. It's painful, and the string manipulation has got to be the worst in the universe, but it's still fun to make text adventure games :)

It'll take you no more than a week, if even that, to learn how to use Visual Basic, so you might as well.

nvoigt
03-10-2002, 02:24 PM
There is a best tool for each job. You have to know all your tools to make a decision which you use. You should have a look into as many languages as you can find. The more you learn, the more you will see, that the language itself is just a tool. What counts is how you use it.

VB is used a lot in the real world. Not because it's a nice language. Not because it allows for beautiful coding constructs. It is used because it get the job done efficiently.

If you know C++/Win32 well, no language will take you more than one or two weeks to learn. Syntax is easy. You could train an ape to learn syntax. The important thing is to know how to construct something. To plan it. To know what happens behind the scenes.

If there is a question of learning it or not, always learn it. Noone ever said he regreted learning something.

I agree on the C# part. It will take a good part of the VB market share. So learn both ;)

incognito
03-10-2002, 02:42 PM
So once you know C++ and Win32 it shouldn't be very hard to learn VB........right?

Prelude
03-10-2002, 03:08 PM
If you have no programming experience at all it shouldn't be too hard to learn VB :P

-Prelude

Brian
03-10-2002, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by Prelude
If you have no programming experience at all it shouldn't be too hard to learn VB :P

-Prelude

VB probably isnt the best option for budding programmers.

Prelude
03-10-2002, 04:19 PM
Sadly, some flavor of BASIC is the first language that most people learn.

-Prelude

Govtcheez
03-10-2002, 04:30 PM
I don't think it's really a bad idea to learn some form of BASIC as a first language (as long as the instructor doesn't abuse goto, like so many of them are known to do)... It's easy enough to not scare people away from programming immediately, and it gives them an idea of how programming should be... That way, when they move onto real languages, they can catch on a little easier...

-KEN-
03-10-2002, 04:57 PM
>>As an aside, I'm currently taking a "Computer Science" course in highschool, and of course it uses visual basic. It's painful, and the string manipulation has got to be the worst in the universe<<

Heh, I had to take the same exact thing before I could get into C/C++ courses. The string manipulation is easy as hell, though...


Dim something as string
something = "this" + " is" + " easy"
label1.caption = something

:) I'm a VB genius.


VB isn't a bad thing to learn, like nvoigt said - learn whatever you want. Learn it all if you want. I certainly don't regret learning it, although the words "mindnumbingly easy" can't seem to stop popping into my thoughts...one thing that did get me with VB was winsock. I tried it one day but couldn't quite get it. Oh well


Oh, and the bad thing about C# is that you need the framework on whatever machine you're running it on - at least VB can compile into an real exe (at least my prof. told me that). Still it's a great language, and you can create the controls manually in your code if you want (which, IMHO, I like better sometimes)

DavidP
03-10-2002, 04:58 PM
BASIC is a very good language to learn as your first language. Although, yes, you must have a good teacher. As I look back on my BASIC days I realize that my teacher never onced touched arrays. In fact, she built a huge wall around arrays and shielded us from them for time and eternity, along with pointers too. She should have taught us those.

>VB probably isnt the best option for budding programmers.

Yes...you probably shouldn't start with VB, but it is definitely easy to learn. I remember when I was learning to program, this was the sequence I learned in:

Logo
BASIC
Toolbook (which we like to call Visual Logo ;) )
Visual Basic

Visual Basic came pretty easily. If you know BASIC, you know Visual Basic (since Visual Basic is a BASIC compiler...for Windows). There were some difficult things, but it came pretty easily.

>I'm currently taking a "Computer Science" course in highschool, and of course it uses visual basic.

Mwahaha...in Computer Science in my school district, they start with C++...mwaha...if you want to learn any form of BASIC whatsoever, you have to take Computer Literacy, which is Middle School, not High School.

dirkduck
03-10-2002, 06:31 PM
I would take the computer programming cource at my school next year...but the 'advanced computer programming class', the highest one, teaches 'advanced topics' such as 'arrays', 'functions', and other big words like that, that you certainly couldnt learn on your own *cough*cprogramming.com tutorials*cough* ;). And you are required to take beginning computer programming before that, which is like 'data types' 'entering code'..and other stuff that you could learn on your own _much_ faster in my opinion.

Prelude
03-10-2002, 07:39 PM
>'advanced topics' such as 'arrays', 'functions', and other big words like that
Oh my, not actual arrays!? How do they manage to get people interested with such devastatingly difficult topics? The teacher is probably incompetent too, but I won't assume anything because I COULD be wrong...though I doubt it.

-Prelude

incognito
03-10-2002, 07:51 PM
Oh well so I guess I shouldn't throw away this book I got.When I ordered Sams Teach Yourself C++ in 21 days from BN they had this offer that if you ordered two you would get free shipping and handling........so STYC++ in 21 was about $35 plus shipping and handling would come out to be close to $45 or $50......so I ordered Sams Teach Yourself Visual Basic 6 in 10 minutes[although I don't really know if it teaches the language itself...I am not sure, I don't know a lot about it......anyways it all looks like drag and drop kind of stuff] (yeah a bunch of crap.....well maybe if you already know some other languages....) so by me buying this one I would be basically getting a free book because I would end up paying about $45 or $50 plus free shipping and handling :D.........so I guess there's no need to throw it away or give it someone else..........Thanks for the help guys.

Shiro
03-11-2002, 12:10 PM
>My question is do you think it's worth it to learn VB

A language is a tool to create software, and depending on the kind of software you want to create, you should learn the language which fits best.

But ofcourse it is never wrong to learn languages.

nvoigt
03-11-2002, 01:01 PM
>at least VB can compile into an real exe

Well... sort of. You need to create an installer to deliver a bunch of DLLs with your exe. Without those DLLs your program won't run. With VC, you can compile one exe that will run on every Windows PC.

If you got a book on VB, great ! Read it. You will find it quite easy if you know how hard C/C++ is. I don't know of any case of knowledge hurting someone ;)

ober
03-11-2002, 01:12 PM
As a VB programmer with C experience... I must say that VB is rather easy to learn... but with any language, as in C, there are things that still take time to learn...

I still haven't mastered full database manipulation and things like winsock... but then again, I'm not the best at catching and passing signals in C either.. or those damn binary trees...