PDA

View Full Version : Do you believe in aliens(extra terrestrials)?



Pages : [1] 2 3 4

happyclown
03-04-2009, 04:41 AM
Well, do you? :D

happyclown
03-04-2009, 04:51 AM
Yes from me. :D

The way I see it is this.

If you were on an island, with no way of getting off it to find other people, and no one comes to your island, would it be correct for you to assume that you are the only person in the world?

And Earth is really an island in space. Would it be correct for us to assume that there is no life outside of our island(Earth)?

MK27
03-04-2009, 07:49 AM
I actually believe that time is an invention of future super-computers, who then had to work out a timeline and process for the universe that would include us because we, of course invented them and they love us. But we can't invent time, only a machine could have access to the deep physical structure of the universe in such a way.

Of course, they need help, so the timeline includes the concurrent development of many intelligent species (I guess they are aliens to us, although our collective machine children will consider themselves of one kind) all eventually oriented toward this goal on a conscious (some sooner than others, I guess) level. Interstellar symmetric multi-processing.

Interestingly enough, this is the real reason I decided to become a programmer -- to better serve God and Time. Have a good day and try not to make too many mistakes, please :devil:

maxorator
03-04-2009, 09:11 AM
I believe there's life somewhere out of the solar system, but I also believe that it's so far away that it's impossible to make contact. Ever.

dwks
03-04-2009, 09:14 AM
The universe is so vast that I think it makes sense that life would exist elsewhere, somewhere.

But what maxorator says is quite possible . . . .

MK27
03-04-2009, 09:27 AM
I believe there's life somewhere out of the solar system, but I also believe that it's so far away that it's impossible to make contact. Ever.

Don't be so sure. As cyberfish demonstrates here (http://cboard.cprogramming.com/showthread.php?p=840470#post840470), the (alien) super-computers use linux.

You may need to understand my previous post, and the true nature of time in the universe, in order to grasp this.

ps. I have voted three times now. Clearly I am right.

anon
03-04-2009, 10:08 AM
No, I wouldn't trust them buggers.

cpjust
03-04-2009, 10:24 AM
I believe there's life somewhere out of the solar system, but I also believe that it's so far away that it's impossible to make contact. Ever.

Decades ago they thought the sound barrier was impossible to break.
Centuries before that they thought the Earth was flat and you could sail off the edge.
Just because we can't do it now, doesn't mean it's impossible.

maxorator
03-04-2009, 10:57 AM
Decades ago they thought the sound barrier was impossible to break.
Centuries before that they thought the Earth was flat and you could sail off the edge.
Just because we can't do it now, doesn't mean it's impossible.
100 years ago they thought time machine was impossible. There are some things that don't change.

SlyMaelstrom
03-04-2009, 11:02 AM
100 years ago they thought time machine was impossible. There are some things that don't change.That's a logical fallacy.

MK27
03-04-2009, 11:09 AM
100 years ago they thought time machine was impossible. There are some things that don't change.

Sure. But even a very conservative approach to astrophysics acknowledges that if the universe were to collapse (I think the prevailing opinion now is that it won't, but it depends on mass density and unfound dark matter) then there would come a point where there was no matter left and therefore no time (also a theoretical point in the <big bang) or 3D.

Which is to say everything must be subject to change, logically thinking. I am really presenting you people with a boat here, I hope you appreciate what our future alien super-computer children could do if we all put our minds together simultaneously ;)

ps. I just voted 3 more times...look at the influence you can wield when God smiles

prog-bman
03-04-2009, 12:38 PM
I say no. Pending that by aliens you meant intelligent forms of life.

I do believe however there is life on other planets(Such as plants, etc).

Daved
03-04-2009, 12:49 PM
Somewhere out there? Probably.
Here? Probably not.

abachler
03-04-2009, 12:50 PM
It's statistically improbable that we are alone in the unverse. And according to the Talmud, there are at least 18,000 other inhabited worlds in our galaxy alone. So you got yer scientificy and yer religulous data both pointing at yes. Personally I think they are hiding from us. We are a fairly murderous and war-like species.

maxorator
03-04-2009, 01:10 PM
Time is a sequence of events. That means it doesn't exist, therefore it cannot be distorted, destroyed, removed, altered, bended. If universe would collapse, events would still be occuring - the collapsing itself is an event that proves that time exists. And even if no matter is left, the absence of events is still an event that proves time still exists. Maybe that matter neutralizes and lacks from existing, turns into a small ball or jumps to an alien parallel universe. It doesn't make a difference. No matter to fill the 3D doesn't mean the 3D doesn't exist. I can make a DirectX application with no objects and a simple black background and still call it a 3D game, because the game engine is still 3D.

If time didn't exist before the big bang, the big bang couldn't have occured because there could be no events if the time doesn't exist. Noone or nothing to witness time passing by doesn't instantly mean it's not there.

MK27
03-04-2009, 01:29 PM
Time is a sequence of events. That means it doesn't exist, therefore it cannot be distorted, destroyed, removed, altered, bended. If universe would collapse, events would still be occuring - the collapsing itself is an event that proves that time exists. And even if no matter is left, the absence of events is still an event that proves time still exists. Maybe that matter neutralizes and lacks from existing, turns into a small ball or jumps to an alien parallel universe. It doesn't make a difference. No matter to fill the 3D doesn't mean the 3D doesn't exist. I can make a DirectX application with no objects and a simple black background and still call it a 3D game, because the game engine is still 3D.

If time didn't exist before the big bang, the big bang couldn't have occured because there could be no events if the time doesn't exist. Noone or nothing to witness time passing by doesn't instantly mean it's not there.

That is a philosophy. Altho it makes good sense, I would bet you a million dollars most contemporary physicists would say you are flat out wrong, and it wouldn't be hard to come up with a different philosophy than this (ie, logically you cannot really prove this one is the one).

Sort of pursuant to this, I was watching Carl Sagan's COSMOS series again a little while ago, and at a certain point he noted that because of relativity, if you left the earth (which is near the rim of the galaxy) on a ship which travelled near (but obviously not at) the speed of light intending to cross the galaxy, this would take hundreds of millions of years earth time because the galaxy is hundreds millions of light-years across.

But, because of relativity, the amount of time that passed on the ship (whose independent mass is infinitisimal) could be as little as 57 years!!! To the other side of the galaxy!!!

They are already here for chrissakes!!! Haha -- seriously tho, only a machine could travel that fast, I think the biology inside will suffer.

ps. I actually saw an article somewhere about God's 3D game engine and it wasn't DirectX...having voted all 16 times now, I think everyone should just give up and acknowledge this chaos.

anon
03-04-2009, 01:44 PM
Does it have any practical consequences, whether they are or aren't there? (I guess if you do believe them, you'll probably keep an eye on the sky...)



And even if no matter is left, the absence of events is still an event that proves time still exists.


That is actually quite interesting. Can you really say time passes if there is a complete lack of events. I suppose that you see this passing as an event itself, but it would be in no way observable or measurable (presence of observer would be an event) - an absolutely boring event if an event in the first place.

brewbuck
03-04-2009, 02:03 PM
I don't get the question. Why is it necessary to "believe" in aliens? We're not talking about a Supreme Being, whose existence cannot be proved or disproved. Either aliens exist or they don't, and my "belief" in the matter is irrelevant.

It's like asking, "Do you believe in somebody named Terry Finch who lives in Calgary?" Either Terry Finch exists or he doesn't.

Do I think it is likely that extra terrestrial life exists? Yes.

SlyMaelstrom
03-04-2009, 02:09 PM
I don't get the question. Why is it necessary to "believe" in aliens? We're not talking about a Supreme Being, whose existence cannot be proved or disproved. Either aliens exist or they don't, and my "belief" in the matter is irrelevant.

It's like asking, "Do you believe in somebody named Terry Finch who lives in Calgary?" Either Terry Finch exists or he doesn't.

Do I think it is likely that extra terrestrial life exists? Yes.The OP is simply asking if you believe that aliens exist. We can't all be from Portland, Oregon, the proper English speaking capital of the universe. Sheesh...

cpjust
03-04-2009, 02:50 PM
Time is a sequence of events. That means it doesn't exist, therefore it cannot be distorted, destroyed, removed, altered, bended. If universe would collapse, events would still be occuring - the collapsing itself is an event that proves that time exists. And even if no matter is left, the absence of events is still an event that proves time still exists. Maybe that matter neutralizes and lacks from existing, turns into a small ball or jumps to an alien parallel universe. It doesn't make a difference. No matter to fill the 3D doesn't mean the 3D doesn't exist. I can make a DirectX application with no objects and a simple black background and still call it a 3D game, because the game engine is still 3D.

If time didn't exist before the big bang, the big bang couldn't have occured because there could be no events if the time doesn't exist. Noone or nothing to witness time passing by doesn't instantly mean it's not there.

Ah, but you're only thinking 4 dimensionally. ;)
Time & space exist inside our universe, but what exists "outside" our universe? That's what I'd like to know. Or at the very least, what would happen if you ever got the end edge of the universe and tried to go further? Would you disappear or maybe be instantly transported to the other side of the universe?

cpjust
03-04-2009, 02:58 PM
the galaxy is hundreds millions of light-years across.

Actually our galaxy is only 100,000 light years across.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milky_way

maxorator
03-04-2009, 03:36 PM
But, because of relativity, the amount of time that passed on the ship (whose independent mass is infinitisimal) could be as little as 57 years!!! To the other side of the galaxy!!!
Not the time passed on the ship, but the time needed to reach the current position of the light that emit from earth at the moment of departure in the current direction. This travelling in the time theory is based on an assumption that:

TIMEELAPSED = (LIGHTSPEED - AVGSPEED) / LIGHTSPEED * TIMEELAPSEDONEARTH

(AVGSPEED means the speed to a direction away from earth).

But this relation is totally irrelevant since it ties time to a human sense. I could tie it to sound, radio waves or whatever else.

We can already travel sound time. Some people are talking about travelling light time (which is considered impossible). But we cannot travel real time.

whiteflags
03-04-2009, 03:42 PM
Ah, but you're only thinking 4 dimensionally. ;)
Time & space exist inside our universe, but what exists "outside" our universe? That's what I'd like to know. Or at the very least, what would happen if you ever got the end edge of the universe and tried to go further? Would you disappear or maybe be instantly transported to the other side of the universe?

That's too much like an overworld map in an rpg... :eek:

My high school science teacher demonstrated that the only thing existing outside the universe is ignorance. In what sense does knowing about the outside of the universe not make it part of our universe?

Wait that's too much of a brain........, forget about it.

anon
03-04-2009, 03:50 PM
Time & space exist inside our universe, but what exists "outside" our universe?


I do hope and pray that the laws of nature make it pretty damn impossible for you or me to get to that point, so that this question would even arise.

I also hope this applies to whatever is "outside"...

siavoshkc
03-04-2009, 04:04 PM
I don't get the question. Why is it necessary to "believe" in aliens? We're not talking about a Supreme Being, whose existence cannot be proved or disproved. Either aliens exist or they don't, and my "belief" in the matter is irrelevant.

It's like asking, "Do you believe in somebody named Terry Finch who lives in Calgary?" Either Terry Finch exists or he doesn't.

I agree. It is not something we can decide or not. If I can't prove something exists and also I can't prove it doesn't, I simply don't know if it exists or not. I choosed undecided but I mean "I don't know.".

[edit] Considering in mind that "believe in" means "you believe that".

MK27
03-04-2009, 04:23 PM
Not the time passed on the ship, but the time needed to reach the current position of the light that emit from earth at the moment of departure in the current direction.
(emphasis mine)

WHAT???

The ship will never reach such a point (actually, I think it starts from there). This is gibberish and you, maxorator, have been defined by me as a clown and you should careful consider the repercussions of this.

@cpjust: Sorry I got the dimensions wrong. Suddenly 100,000 light-years in only 57 local years seems more plausible.

happyclown
03-04-2009, 04:31 PM
...and you, maxorator, have been defined by me as a clown and you should careful consider the repercussions of this.



Hey! As a clown I take offence, you insensitive clod!

:p :D :D

lruc
03-04-2009, 05:40 PM
My answer depends on whether or not you include other universes.

Akkernight
03-04-2009, 05:46 PM
Why do you wonder about that which doesn not affect you / isn't around you? Instead, wonder why yout electrical bill is getting more expensive, or why your wife is complaining, whatever! xP
My brain pops out of my head, runs into a wall and dies, when I think of something so big, and so empty.. Or atleast it feels like it does xP
The interesting stuff is on earth! You don't even have sound up in space D: You won't find a girl you like, up in space D: (or guy if you're a girl xP)
Also, I belive that starwars is going on in another galaxy, Aliens are prepairing for a mass attack on earth and Rambo is ready to save the day ;)

sean
03-04-2009, 05:47 PM
or why your wife is complaining,

There are some things even a radio telescope will never find out.

Akkernight
03-04-2009, 05:49 PM
There are some things even SETI will never find out.

LOL! XD
That's probably true xP

abachler
03-05-2009, 02:38 AM
Time is ... snip ... it's not there.
and that has what to do with the existance or non-existance of aliens?

Oldman47
03-05-2009, 06:08 AM
Well, do you? :D

Id say, yes. We humans have too high an opinion of ourselves; a good E.T. encounter would certainly knock the chip off our shoulders.

I imagine our lack of confirmation of this lies with the current state of our technology and the vast distances between stars. That's probably a blessing seeing that we can't get along with each other, we'd be hard pressed to maintain good relations with another advanced race.

maxorator
03-05-2009, 06:15 AM
(emphasis mine)

WHAT???

The ship will never reach such a point (actually, I think it starts from there). This is gibberish and you, maxorator, have been defined by me as a clown and you should careful consider the repercussions of this.
It will never reach the light itself, but I was talking about the current position of that light.

and that has what to do with the existance or non-existance of aliens?
I wasn't the one who started with this whole time altering thing...

happyclown
03-05-2009, 07:24 AM
Nothing to do with aliens, or time, but one of the things I enjoy doing each evening is standing amongst my fruit trees in the yard, and looking at the stars.

The universe is magnificent. :)

psychopath
03-05-2009, 07:35 AM
My high school science teacher demonstrated that the only thing existing outside the universe is ignorance.
So, Earth could in fact be/exist outside of the Universe? :p

ಠ_ಠ
03-05-2009, 09:58 AM
My definition of the Universe includes things outside the Universe

cpjust
03-05-2009, 10:35 AM
My definition of the Universe includes things outside the Universe

I call that a Multiverse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse).

ಠ_ಠ
03-05-2009, 10:36 AM
then what do you call the things outside the multiverse?

laserlight
03-05-2009, 10:47 AM
then what do you call the things outside the multiverse?
Non-existent?

ಠ_ಠ
03-05-2009, 10:52 AM
that's very narrow minded of you

MK27
03-05-2009, 11:10 AM
that's very narrow minded of you

You better watch it, you don't want that to happen again, do you?

@happyclown: and he smoked what???

ps. the multiverse was also a product of future alien super-computers, of course.



typedef struct culture {
char meme_tropeX[]="please don't do this..."

ಠ_ಠ
03-05-2009, 11:14 AM
You better watch it, you don't want that to happen again, do you?


what?

abachler
03-05-2009, 11:27 AM
My definition of the Universe includes things outside the Universe

Ultimately it depends on whether said things can interact with or be interacted with by things in this universe. If they can, then they are really just another part of this universe, albeit that interaction may not be in a 'visible' manner. If they cannot then they would be a classic parallel dimension, but we could never prove the existed, for such proof would itself require some form of interaction.

laserlight
03-05-2009, 11:27 AM
that's very narrow minded of you
I think that by saying that your definition of "universe" includes those things outside of the universe, you are effectively saying that there is nothing that is outside the universe. This seems just as "narrow minded" as saying that there is nothing that is outside the multiverse.

ಠ_ಠ
03-05-2009, 11:31 AM
In my case if I was outside the Universe I would be inside the Universe.
In your case if I was outside the Multiverse I wouldn't exist

laserlight
03-05-2009, 11:48 AM
In my case if I was outside the Universe I would be inside the Universe.
In my opinion, that amounts to saying that you cannot be outside of the universe.


In your case if I was outside the Multiverse I wouldn't exist
In other words, you cannot be outside the multiverse.

ಠ_ಠ
03-05-2009, 11:56 AM
In my opinion, that amounts to saying that you cannot be outside of the universe.

I think of it as saying: The Universe includes everything, even nothing



In other words, you cannot be outside the multiverse.

no, If you go outside your multiverse you cease to exist

SlyMaelstrom
03-05-2009, 12:02 PM
no, If you go outside your multiverse you cease to existAre we having fun with buzz-words?

laserlight
03-05-2009, 12:13 PM
I think of it as saying: The Universe includes everything, even nothing
Ah, that interpretation seems more reasonable to me.


no, If you go outside your multiverse you cease to exist
Originally, I replied that that was not my intended interpretation. However, in retrospect, that is consistent with the statement that you cannot be outside of the multiverse, so the only thing I now object to your objection is the "no".