View Full Version : Why Linux Will Beat Microsoft

02-14-2002, 08:30 PM
All Empires fall. The reason why Linux will eventually destroy Microsoft is because someone will take action to make it a real corporation and they will actually write and market some good applications for it. The Communist philosophy of free software has been a double edged sword. It has gotten Linux popularity, but it has also made it unacceptable to the neo classical economic structure that the Western economies scale with. I think that Linux could compete very well if they became a real corporation because they could offer a lower cost alternative to Windows and a stable, powerful operating system.

02-14-2002, 08:39 PM
He's back to Linux again. Let's see how long it lasts.

02-14-2002, 09:03 PM
At the risk of sounding impartial I neither accept nor reject your opinion, whatever it may be.

02-14-2002, 09:40 PM
I think the lack of a standard is what's been holding Linux from beating Windows to the ground. But it has begun.

In the next few years I think MS will lose much of their domination. The effort IBM is putting into Linux is a good sign. The recent economy downturn has really opened the door for Linux.

02-14-2002, 09:48 PM
is troll king schizophrenic?

02-14-2002, 09:51 PM
!~Way to retire Troll_King~!


02-14-2002, 10:20 PM
is troll king schizophrenic?

No, I'm not a fortune teller. And in regard to Linux making gains, that might be true but they have gained nothing on Microsoft because that would have to mean that Microsoft is losing money. There is no evidence of that, infact WinXP has been Microsofts most successful operating system in terms of sales. They are making more money than ever.

I would give Linux a real try but I would want confidence in their GUI. I don't like some aspects of MS Windows, for example the fact that you can not remove all applications from the Add/Remove Programs feature in the Control Panel. I also know that MS Windows has some systemic problems that are supposed to be taken care of with the .NET framework, yet that does not eliminate the problem because you can still write viruses that do not run on .NET, yet still run on MS Windows. Do you get what I'm saying? .NET might patch security issues for .NET apps but it doesn't eliminate ways for programs not targeting the .NET framework.

I would like to know more about Linux but I want a good GUI, a lot of books on programming for it, and I would also want a direction with Linux, for example not just here is the operating system but here is a way for developers to make a living writing applications for Linux. MS Windows does this well, but not necessarity the best operating system. I'm not sure which one is the best, but I do know that there is a lot more to Windows than most people know. All I have to do is look at MCSE and Inside Windows 2000 3rd edition.

02-15-2002, 12:25 AM
It is historically true that all empires(Microsoft) fall, but don't unorganized tribes(Linux) fall faster? I think it will be a loooooong time before Microsoft is overthrown, if ever, because of the vice it has on the industry. Most of us are accustomed to it, and I know that almost all casual users are not willing to learn a new OS. Maybe Linux will be a force in the world of servers and business, but probably never at home.

02-15-2002, 12:32 AM
Many home users don't like Windows but there is no alternative it seems because Linux is not user friendly enough. Windows is able to be both a powerful and an easy to use operating system. If I were to use Linux than I want strong hardware compatibility, I would like applications, and a easy to use GUI. There is no reason why Linux could not harness it's power underneath a friendly GUI.

02-15-2002, 12:37 AM
I have two reasons: 1) Most people are STUPID. They bearely know how to work their computer. I have many friends who are like this. They don't want to try something new, they are already struggling, they don't want to start over. 2) Software compatibility. You can't run Windows programs on Linux unless you use something like Wine, which is a pile of crap. It's a possibility that Linux could be successfull if they could get Windows programs to work on Linux. But I don't know if it's possible to emulate Windows like that in an efficient manner.

02-15-2002, 01:10 AM
MS Windows professional operating systems are very powerful yet they hide the power under an easy to use GUI.

.NET is the link between Linux and Windows because the .NET framework allows programs to run on any OS that develops it's own .NET compilers. I hear that Linux is going to take advantage of this.

To say that Windows is a simple OS is a grave mistake, and infact it's what keeps Linux back. Total under estimation of Windows. I'm in the belief that MS Windows is the most sophisticated operating system, however there are some problems with it that I mentioned in previous posts.

You look at Win9X and Win2k and it looks the very same, but they are totally different operating systems. It is a mistake to make an OS more complex to use than necessary. A nice GUI is what gets people using the OS. A nice GUI can give you all the power you want but the basic most used operations should be highly accessible.

02-15-2002, 01:35 AM
While all programmers and/or computer gurus may sit back all day saying how much better Linux is than Windows, it will not overtake windows anytime soon simply because the general public isn't used to it. There are a few reasons this will never happen:

1. Cost - It's expensive for someone with a home PC, especially someone who just uses their computer for basic work, to replace all of their softwere to change OS's.

2. Microsoft's dominance - While linux may be better as long as the major companies ie. Dell, Gateway, Compact etc. are selling their machines with Windows on them people aren't going to change. Lets be honest your average guy on the streer new computer buyer isn't going to have the no how nore the drive to uninstall windows and install Linux.

3. Compatibility - Lets face it all those flashy new programs that blink more than they work are what people like my father, someone who knows very little about computers, want. They are programs that do almost everything automated and don't make the user do much.

4. "Ease of Use" - Ok this one's a stretch but...While many people here may find Linux much easier to use the general market who barely know what RAM is much less layered softwere don't. Windows, especially windows XP, is made so that 99% of the operations and setup are totally automated and it is very hard for the user to do things manually. I literally spent 10 minutes trying to just get to the point where i could manually enter IPs for networking on the XP machine. It wanted to do it all itself. While this is very stupid to most of us, to your average Joe this is great! Less chances to break the computer!

5. Name/Product recognition - Pepsi had a real hard time getting into the market till Coke had to give up the trademark on "Cola." Also for many users it was hard enough to learn how to get around on the basics on one OS. For those of you who have taught a parent or a grandparent or some person who's totally computer illiterate how to use Windows can you imagine RE-teaching them Linux? <--There's something I don't want to do! Moreover what do those computer iliterate people do if they running Linux at work and Windows at home? Talk about confusion.

If we all knew our way around windows or were all computer geniuses then I'd agree with Troll that it has a good shot at taking over. But we're not, so it won't.

02-15-2002, 02:04 AM
I think it's the younger generation that will boost Linux. Just about every kid I know is computer literate (unlike most of their parents). They're growing up in a time where Linux is becoming popular and they can buy it in nice packages on the shelf of any store that sells computer software. Businesses are finally finding the value in switching to Linux systems and with each new verison they get closer and closer to the simplicity of Windows. This definitely won't be an overnight attack, but the tides will be changing.
After all, Linux is the fastest growing OS right now (according to articles I've been reading).

02-15-2002, 02:26 AM
I think that Linux can be as complex as it wants to be but also as friendly as MS Windows to the general commercial audience, but it should try to target that audience. It isn't a matter of whether or not you are smart because if you want to use the Command Prompt than nothing is stopping you, nor is anything stopping you from installing any Shell that you want such as C-Shell, Bourne-Shell and Korn Shell. This should not disturb the GUI.

02-15-2002, 04:16 AM
>Just about every kid I know is computer literate

Well, we obviously know different people. Every person I know can make a computer perform basic operations. The kiddies think they are computer literate, because they know how to surf and play games. But they are not. None of them could install Linux on their own. None of them know why they have the OS they have. They use it because it's cool to have the latest Windows stuff.

Security with Microsoft is indeed a thing to be mentioned. But face it, the most insecure thing on earth is a user. The most successful virii around are the ones that require the user to do something stupid. Like executing an .exe file or script. And a user who would do this in windows, would do it in Linux as well. The key to security is not secure programs. Everything created by humans can be destroyed by humans. The key is educating people. Not how to use Windows or Linux, but general things. Probably with Windows as an example. Teach them not to be stupid.

I use Windows. I use a firewall. I feel secure. Not because it's unbreakable. Some black hats may crack that open in 5 minutes. But remember the story of the halfling and the dragon:

"When you find yourself in the company of a halfling and an ill-tempered Dragon, remember, you do not have to outrun the Dragon..."

"...you just have to outrun the halfling."

02-15-2002, 05:11 AM
Not only will Linux beat Microsoft one day, Linux will kill Bill Gates. Mark my words.

02-15-2002, 07:00 AM
Originally posted by tim545666
It is historically true that all empires(Microsoft) fall, but don't unorganized tribes(Linux) fall faster?

Are you an F-ing moron?? OMG... "unorganized tribes(Linux)"... where do you come up with this BS? Not to flame or anything, but how bout making an intelligent comment? Since when is a 20 something year old "empire" as you call it, more organized than an OS that has been in development for over 30 years? Granted, Linux and it's recreations have only been around for approx 10 years, but it's freakin UNIX... the basis of all OSes.. no major changes, just a little pizzaz...

But I do agree with you on one point, most people in this world are morons and don't have the time or energy to learn what a good OS is, let alone even begin to understand it...

ok... I'm gonna shutup now.. I'm gettin on the *nix soapbox again.. :rolleyes:

02-15-2002, 07:09 AM
> The most successful virii around are the ones that require the user to do something stupid

Yeah, I was wondering about that last night on my drive home. If I made a program that just had a button on it that said "Press me to format your HDD", I wonder how many people would press it...

02-15-2002, 08:25 AM
Yeah, I was wondering about that last night on my drive home. If I made a program that just had a button on it that said "Press me to format your HDD", I wonder how many people would press it...

Probably 40% of the computer users I know. And thats scary. Do you know anyone who would disable his brakes upon receiving a letter stating it would be a faster ride ? Noone would do this. Not even 5%.

I don't really think our problem are Microsofts gaping Security holes... as long as we have undereducated people in front of the machines, they will never be secure. I personally know people who use little post-its to attach their password to the monitor, because they "can't remember" it.

02-15-2002, 08:28 AM
> And thats scary.

Yeah, sure is...

And what's scarier - it probably wouldn't be illegal... (std disclaimer) It's not like it maliciously did it. It asked, and the user said "Sure, I don't know what the hell that means. The computer must be right.", and then did it...

02-15-2002, 10:06 AM
Most impires crack from within. I think that as long as MS can stay inventiv they will stay on top but the day they stop coming up with good ideas they will be history.

02-15-2002, 11:43 AM
i couldn't resist....*sigh*

i'm a linux user, and it will never find a home on the average user's desktop. GUI's are really a second thought with Linux, and i don't really see them being better than anything microsotf can crank out.

RedHat's even realized this and are refocusing on what linux does best. it is the fasting growing operating system on the server. i could even see it replacing Windows on technical workstations and such where the user has a deeper knowledge base...look to OpenBeOS for the desktop threat. i'm calling it now;)

02-15-2002, 05:22 PM
Microsoft should clean up it's registry and allow all aplication that are installed to be removable in the control panel under add/remove programs. If this means that they have to make .NET the only framework in which to target the operating system than they should do that. Programs that are not .NET or 'managed' should not be deployable on a Microsoft Operating System. That would clean up a lot of crud that the home user and also a developer student like myself accumulates. Just wait and see MS make this move.

02-15-2002, 06:00 PM
>Programs that are not .NET or 'managed' should not be deployable on a Microsoft Operating System

Until garbage collectors are as efficient as hand written clean up, no o/s will rely on applications based on 'managed' code despite the security advantages (although some garbage collectors are supposedly quicker than your average coder - where have I heard this argument before?? ).

02-16-2002, 04:24 AM
>But just think if people were computer liiterate what would we do?

We would still code... coding takes more than knowledge how to work safely with a tool called computer. Coding is making the tool available.

However, I could probably spend my weekends without explaining the concept of device drivers to someone who doesn't know what end of the graphics card belongs in the slot. Maybe I would not have to tell my friend that as all his mp3 files are gone and all his jpgs end in .vbs, he probably caught a virus. Maybe I wouldn't need to explain that I am not a moron if I can't get divx to run on my friends PC. Yes, it's showing movies fine on my PC, but my PC has about 476 MB RAM more than his. Maybe I wouldn't need to explain that RAM is not the same as free HDD space.

In one point in the future, people will see that having the money to buy a tool in no way means being able to use it.


02-16-2002, 05:19 AM
More money you pay, more stuff gets done for you.