Thread: Recommend a book.

Originally Posted by Happy_Reaper

You a climber, cheez ?

So I finished Into Thin Air last night, and Krakauer spends about 15-20 pages ripping on DeWalt and saying that a lot of the stuff he wrote about was fabricated. From what I gather, DeWalt seems really interested in defending Boukreev by any means necessary, even if it means butchering quotes from people and paiting Krakauer as some sort of a hit artist (something I didn't get from Into Thin Air at all). I'm not sure I want to read The Climb because of it, but I probably will in the interest of seeing (DeWalt's version of ) Boukreev's story.

For now I am moving on to Baseball Between the Numbers. After that I'd like to try and tackle Morris's biographies of Teddy Roosevelt again. I read half of the first one last summer, couldn't put it down for a week, and then just stopped. I don't know why.

So I finished Into Thin Air last night, and Krakauer spends about 15-20 pages ripping on DeWalt and saying that a lot of the stuff he wrote about was fabricated. From what I gather, DeWalt seems really interested in defending Boukreev by any means necessary, even if it means butchering quotes from people and paiting Krakauer as some sort of a hit artist (something I didn't get from Into Thin Air at all). I'm not sure I want to read The Climb because of it, but I probably will in the interest of seeing (DeWalt's version of ) Boukreev's story.

Well I haven't finished the whole thing yet, but I haven't seen DeWalt particularly rip into Krakauer yet. It does portray him as a typical media type, though, thinking that the guides would lead him safely to the top without him having to do any effort. But from what Boukreev said, that was the general feeling for many of the expedition members. Boukreev, I think, never really felt comfortable with the expedition.

I would agree, as well, that he does seem to defend Boukreev quite a bit, often times almost to a fault. But considering what he did, it's hard to really push guilt onto him.

What did Krakauer think of Boukreev ?

He questions Boukreev going down before the group and says that in general he stayed too far away from the people he was supposed to be guiding. He also criticized him for not using supplemental oxygen as a guide (there are a lot of quotes from other guides saying basically the same thing).

However, he does say that Anatoli was basically singlehandedly responsible for rescuing the people stuck on the South Col.

He doesn't particularly blame Boukreev for anything, but he does make it sound like Boukreev's actions weren't particularly "guidelike" and that there are quite a few holes in his story. There's plenty of blame to go around, and Anatoli's not singled out for any more of it than Fischer or Hall or Lopsang or anyone. The only people he really rips into are the Taiwanese and South African expeditions.

This is the only thing I've read about the events, so I'm looking at it through Krakauer's eyes, but it does seem weird that DeWalt is so quick to jump all over Krakauer as a "typical media type" when Krakauer was an accomplished climber and DeWalt wasn't even there.

It's probably because he sees it through Boukreev's eyes. Krakauer, if I remember correctly, was at first supposed to go with Boukreev and Fischer's expedition, but at some point, the mag he was writing for (Outdoors, I think) decided to switch into Rob Hall's expedition. Whether that was Krakauer's decision or not, I don't know, but he left their expedition for a more "famous" one, so to Fischer and his team, it probably looked like he was going for show.

As for the supplemental oxygen, the Mountain Madness expedition was extremely lacking in oxygen canisters even before their bid for the top. They'd started with a very tight supply at the outset, and then one of their Sherpa's had gone down with HEMA at camp 2 and had used a couple there. Then one of their clients, Pete Schoeling, came down with the same thing. Once they reached camp 4, there was barely enough for the clients. There's even a quote from Boukreev saying that, although he was intending to go without supplemental, that he'd asked Fischer for 2 "just in case" canisters. Fischer only nodded and said "we'll see" (or something along those lines).
Although he ended up getting the canisters he wanted, both Boukreev and Beidelman (the other guide) went up with no Os. Even Fischer (who was already in pretty bad shape), had to be convinced to take some with him. In the end, Boukreev never really used the oxygen. He ended up giving one to Beidelman, and then one to Pittman, I believe.

That being said, I do agree that Boukreev seemed in quite a bit of a rush to get back. I remember him supplying a reason for that, but I also remember thinking that it wasn't really all that good.

And again, I see these things through Boukreev's eyes, so its hard to get an unbiased position.

> Krakauer, if I remember correctly, was at first supposed to go with Boukreev and Fischer's expedition, but at some point, the mag he was writing for (Outdoors, I think) decided to switch into Rob Hall's expedition.

Yeah, if I remember right they put him in Hall's because of the extra publicity.

> I remember him supplying a reason for that, but I also remember thinking that it wasn't really all that good.

Supposedly he had a conversation with Fischer where Fischer told him to go down, but no one else witnessed it. DeWalt claims Fischer told the Base Camp Manager about it, but she says he made brief mention of it a couple weeks before the ascent and no one brought it up after that.

I don't remember the stuff about where supplemental oxygen was doled out, but I've probably just forgotten. I'll check and see later

> And again, I see these things through Boukreev's eyes, so its hard to get an unbiased position.

Likewise.

Jennifer Government by Max Barry. It's just enjoyable to read.

I like reading classic Russian literatures, such as works by Leo Tolstoy and Feodor Dostoevsky.
And I like Tolstoy's "War and Peace" most; however, I suggest watching the movie of it first by Audrey Hepburn and Henry Fonda, then read the novel.

Dostoevsky's "Crime and Punishment" is a fine novel, too. It depicts about a man who have lost his meaning of life, and then in the end he'd find the meaning of life was to...

Also, Thomas More's "Utopia", I loved it.

Originally Posted by Utopus

I like reading classic Russian literatures, such as works by Leo Tolstoy and Feodor Dostoevsky.
And I like Tolstoy's "War and Peace" most; however, I suggest watching the movie of it first by Audrey Hepburn and Henry Fonda, then read the novel.

Dostoevsky's "Crime and Punishment" is a fine novel, too. It depicts about a man who have lost his meaning of life, and then in the end he'd find the meaning of life was to...

Also, Thomas More's "Utopia", I loved it.

that's my kind of reading! Dosto is my all time favorite author.

But if anyone wants to read the best 20th century American novel read The Invisible Man by Ellison. BTW the book is heavily inspired by Dostoevsky - especially Notes from the Underground. If anyone wants to talk about the above, let me know.

Also, Jeremy recommended a book a few months ago that was great - Into the Wild by Krakauer. The book isn't written particularly well but the topic is fantastic, and I'm certain that many people on this board would benefit from reading it.

[edit] ooops posted before reading the whole thread. I see that he mentioned it above [/edit]

Fatherland by Robert Harris.

Originally Posted by Amazon

It is twenty years after Nazi Germany's triumphant victory in World War II and the entire country is preparing for the grand celebration of the FÜhrer's seventy-fifth birthday, as well as the imminent peacemaking visit from President Kennedy.

Meanwhile, Berlin Detective Xavier March -- a disillusioned but talented investigation of a corpse washed up on the shore of a lake. When a dead man turns out to be a high-ranking Nazi commander, the Gestapo orders March off the case immediately. Suddenly other unrelated deaths are anything but routine.

Now obsessed by the case, March teams up with a beautiful, young American journalist and starts asking questions...dangerous questions. What they uncover is a terrifying and long-concealed conspiracy of such astonding and mind-numbing terror that is it certain to spell the end of the Third Reich -- if they can live long enough to tell the world about it.

The Eyre Affair by Jasper Fforde plus it's 3 sequels

Originally Posted by New York Times

A combination of fantasy, comedy, science fiction, Douglas Adams, Kurt Vonnegut, Lewis Carroll, Monty Python and even 'Buffy the Vampire Slayer'.

This one is hard to describe. Hilarious. Fascinating. Great. You cannot really describe that firework of ideas, you just have to read it.

Plague Maker by Tim Downs. An evil scientist is trying to kill the world's population by using the bubonic plague.

[edit] And poor Salem is going to have to choose from this ever-growing list. Let's hope that the token is worth a lot. ;-)

Originally Posted by divineleft

the dune series by frank herbert is very awesome science fiction / philosophy

I agree.

Some books / novels that I've read and recommend are:
1. Dune (Frank Herbert): Where sci-fi meets philosophy. Been a fan for anything Dune.
2. Taiko & Musashi (Eiji Yoshikawa): Semi biographical books on 2 Japanese figure. One is about Toyotomi Hideyoshi , and the other about Miyamoto Musashi
3. Dark Elf Trilogy (R.A. Salvatore): I just like the anti hero type of character like Drizzt Do'urden.

The Dresden Files by Jim Butcher is a good series. There are 9 books in the series so far (I'm on #8 now, "Proven Guilty"). The first book is "Storm Front" if you want to start at the beginning. It's a very cowboy-ish storyline, centered around a modern day wizard trying to make a living as a Private Eye. The magic/mythos is excellently done, and Dresden deals with so many different things, from werewolves to demons, faerie, vampires, and a whole lot more. If you've seen the Dresden Files on Sci-Fi, it is very much like the Harry Potter movies vs. the books, but the tv show had some plotlines that weren't in the books thus far. Dresden is also very tongue-in-cheek. There have been some one-liners within the context of the stories that made me drop the books from the laughter.

I liked the Kusheil's series a lot as well. Kushiel's Dart took me a bit to get into, but once I did and became familiar with the characters, I couldn't put the books down.