"iraq war- the unspoken truth"

***ClownPimp*** · 02-23-2003

>Also, that article is Horse SH*****, did u know that America gets 25% of it's oil from that region and Europe gets 70+% from that region - europeans are the one's who should be worried about oil and not the US... U will all have lower gas prices when this issue is resolved, guaranteed.

You obviously didnt read much of the article. The article was about the economic ramifications of OPEC changing its currency to the euro. It had nothing to do with a drop in oil production.

As I said earlier, trying to prevent the proliferation of WMD is fine -- im all for it. But Bush's actions have shown that there is more to his lust for Saddam's blood than WMD. I want to know what that is before I support any war.

**Commander** · 02-23-2003

i don;t like the war or saddam, in fact i hate both of em. but, as us said, go to war to remove saddam is totally stupid and pointless because the removing of ONE man from office does not justify the deaths of millions of innocent people from both sides.

and as for the article, i believe it's truly possible and could be true because the US hasen't given out any NEW reasons or connection to terrorists organization. (and the new OBL tape, imo is a fake and was produced to create a "link")

**dP munky** · 02-23-2003

>>and the new OBL tape, imo is a fake and was produced to create a "link
oh it is? and what would a real tape sound like?

**OneStiffRod** · 02-23-2003

Osama Bin Laden is DEAD, courtesy of a US 2000lb. JDAM in Afghanistan or a 15,000lb. tree cutter bomb.... his bones are buried in some collapsed cave in the tora bora mountains.

The tapes are most likely the work of someone who sounds like osama - dare to think that maybe it's one of osama's many son's who, **HOW UNLIKELY**, sound just like their father with the same speech inflections and mannerisms.

I think privately that US military commanders believe that osama is dead but won't say publicly, although they allude to it in saying that there is no evidence that he is alive or dead and this fight is not about one man. I also think that certain govt. sectors and especially congressman find it convenient to keep the osama threat alive - but he's ded.

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The reason the vietnam conflict took millions of lives was b/c the war was not being fought to win - but instead dragged out into attrition over 10+years. This will not be the case in IRAQ as we will fight to win and win quickly and decisively... it's long drawn out conflicts that take millions of lives - maybe like the 12+years we've been at WAR with IRAQ. The US will save lives by finally ending this conflict and not dragging out another 5 years of saddam refusing UN/US aid to feed his ppl just so he can get the propoganda affect of blaming the US for the deaths.

Choose your poison - inspire rebelions within IRAQ with US support and have iraqi's kill iraqi's for the next 25 years and turn that region into what Afghanistan used to be, I think we know how that will end - the US will have to go back in in 25years or go in with full force and take down saddam's regime - It's also not about just saddam - it's also his cronies who govern his military and his son's.

***ClownPimp*** · 02-24-2003

How did you reach that conclusion without any evidence? What about all the evidence that he is still alive (sightings, tapes). Of course the tapes could be fake. Then again, Allah could have brought Bin Laden up to heaven to protect him from the bombs. The point is, we dont know. And it is ignorant to assume anything without any evidence.

**jessie23** · 02-24-2003

1. yes there is oil in alaska but there is a strong enviromental factor up there.

2. yes india and pakistan have wmd, but they are not aiming them at the us, just each other so we are less worried about them. (note: this is not necesarily my view just an explanation im making)

3. for now i thing north korea is on the back burner with a kind of "we'll deal with them after we finish iraq kind of attitude"

4.what will we do when we run out of oil everwhere????

5. Saddam is a bad person. if this war gets finished with few deaths and saddam people have improved living conditions when it is all said and done, that would be wonderful. whether or not it will happen who knows.

**Shiro** · 02-24-2003

if he show the world that he has no MDW

How can he show he has something not? I don't think it is possible for someone to proof that the person has something not. But the person can ask another independent person to check if the person has that something. If the other can't proof the person has that something, than it still is not a very good proof, but the chance that the person doesn't have that something is smaller than it was before. The same is with the UN inspectors. Saddam must give them the freedom to search anywhere in Iraq and the UN must give the inspectors the time and materials they need for their search. It doesn't guarantee that when they don't find something Saddam doesn't have mass destruction weapons, but the chance is decreased.

I still doubt it because the Truth is he still at least want keep it in some mean/ways.

Especially now Saddam wants to keep his weapons and in some way he has right to. If you are offended, then you have the right to defend. Just thinking, in some way Bush acts like a good muslim: an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth.

I wonder how the UN or other countries will say to Americans if someday they find that Saddam still has some of MDW or Saddam give it to some Anti-American groups include terrorists to attack Americans?

As from what I regularly read in the newspapers and see on the news is that terrorists don't get their weapons from people like Saddam. They get them from the Russians. The Russian maffia sells Russian army weapons which they get because some Russian soldiers see it as a way to get money.

ok, its obvious that none of us really agree on one set thing, so what the hell are we supposed to do.......?

Can we do anything? Perhaps it is better to concentrate mainly on your own small world, that is the world you can change directly. Here in the Netherlands there is a saying called "A better world starts at yourself". You can't change the whole world directly, however you can help the world changing. Like giving money to the organisations who help the millions of people in Africa starving because of hunger, aids and war. Or by helping those organisations in some other way.

europeans are the one's who should be worried about oil and not the US

Why should we be worried about oil? Here in the Netherlands we have a small oilfield under the Waddensea, but we don't use the oilfield, it is a national park. We won't give up nature because of something stupid called money. Destroyed nature can probably never be made good by money.

It's the US who has it's forces over there to CONTAIN saddam

Yes and it is also the US and the western world which has supported Saddam to get where he currently is.

**OneStiffRod** · 02-24-2003

I think you should remove -Karl Marx- from your sig, how would u like it if I put hitler quotes in my sig... I generally don't care but seeing as you are one of the ppl to take offense to things I don't know why u would have a quote from an EVIL CRIMINAL like Karl Marx.

>>Why should we be worried about oil?
Now that is an oblivious statement if I ever saw one, the whole world runs on oil, I don't like it, and most westerners don't like it but it's the truth - tell me what your country men would do if gas became 5euros/gallon.... They would be in the streets with anger - you are as much oil fiends as we my friend.

>>Yes and it is also the US and the western world which has supported Saddam to get where he currently is.

It's much more france and russia who are responsible for IRAQ's state - half of IRAQ's military arms are french, like fighters and anti-aircraft systems - the other half russian. The french also built saddam a nuclear power plant capable of creating fissile material - thankfully the israelis destroyed it, remember the world condemed israel for doing it, even your country - but what foresight they had. When the soviet union collapsed it removed all restraints on the dictatorships they inspired like saddam - even today just look around we are still cleaning up the mess of the soviet union - that mess includes North Korea which will be dealt with shortly.

>>Perhaps it is better to concentrate mainly on your own small world, that is the world you can change directly. Here in the Netherlands there is a saying called "A better world starts at yourself".

Oh, I wish we could have a world like that - but remember Sept. 11, other ppl's foreign wars are brought to bear on us - they don't keep it in their own backyard. Whether we like it or not events that take place in other regions have an affect on us directly or indirectly and ignoring it will not make it go away - in fact the US was quite happily content to focus on it's own problems until Osama struck... this has changed our awareness and thinking - Prez. George Bush didn't even know or I doubt he even cared about the names of leaders around the world - but today I bet there isn't a leader he doesn't know the name of - alot of americans didn't even know where afghanistan was on the map until after that tragic event... We cannot sit back and pretend to ignore a threat that is growing and dangerous - Saddam is a threat along the same lines as Osama Bin Laden - only a much LARGER caliber.

**minesweeper** · 02-24-2003

>>tell me what your country men would do if gas became 5euros/gallon<<

Wow, we'd be rejoicing if it was that cheap. You have no idea how expensive petrol is over here. It's daylight robbery.

**Fountain** · 02-24-2003

Originally posted by minesweeper
I

Something I think is appallng by Blair is the situation in Zimbabwe. For those who don't know, there are thousands of British Ex-pats living in Zimbabwe. President Mugabe has mounted a campaign of slaughter to butcher all these people in a bid to rid the country of white people. He has destroyed everything they have and killed and maimed entire families. Yet Blair has spoken before the Nation and said he will do nothing. These ex-pats wish to come back but have no money to do so. It seems we have the resources to bomb Iraq, the willingness to offer asylum to ex-Taliban fighters, but we can't airlift our own citizens to safety and give them a new start in England. I think much of the behaviour by our leaders is disgusting.

Ummm I work with a lady from Zimbabwe, who is the nicest person I have ever met. Her family are ex-pats/farmers. Of course,after 2 generations her family has had to return to UK. She in NO way has anything bad/detremental to say against the UK or Government.....IT is NOT our fault.

Second-WE (UK) are a lot closer targets than our American Allies for WMD. Think about this before you pansys say war is a bad thing.

Have a nice day.

Dang! I forgot to slap the person who says 'let the inspectors get on with their work-they will find them'

Yeh, right. Places that are hidden well are never found-and I believe everyone knows it anyway.

**dP munky** · 02-24-2003

>>Second-WE (UK) are a lot closer targets than our American Allies for WMD. Think about this before you pansys say war is a bad thing.

yeah, and youre a lot closer to the middle east for terror attacks, and um, i believe WE(USA) had 3000 people killed, and whats the difference, distance really (in my opinion) has no effect on who's getting attacked. besides, w/missles, minutes are really a small measurment of time.

>>Wow, we'd be rejoicing if it was that cheap. You have no idea how expensive petrol is over here. It's daylight robbery

i love how all you people from other countries are so quick to go against anything we americans say to point out how dumb we are and then not inform us of how things are.

**minesweeper** · 02-24-2003

>>Ummm I work with a lady from Zimbabwe, who is the nicest person I have ever met. Her family are ex-pats/farmers. Of course,after 2 generations her family has had to return to UK. She in NO way has anything bad/detremental to say against the UK or Government.....IT is NOT our fault.<<

Like you say, she has had to come back here. That's great, but what about all those people who can't come back here through lack of funds? What will happen to them? They will be killed no doubt. How is the story of a woman fortunate enough to be able to get out relevant to the plights of the people who can't and are being hunted down?

And no it's not our fault that Mugabe is killing people. It wasn't our fault that Milosovic was killing people either, but we didn't hesitate to go the aid of his victims did we?

**minesweeper** · 02-24-2003

>>i love how all you people from other countries are so quick to go against anything we americans say to point out how dumb we are and then not inform us of how things are.<<

No, you read it wrong, or maybe I wrote it wrong, I don't know. Anyway, it wasn't meant as a 'you ignorant yanks don't know anything'. It was more like me saying, 'damn, you have no idea how cold it was today'. Figure of speech.

Anyway, petrol prices right now:

80p per litre.

1 gallon = 4.5 litres
1 gallon = £3.60
£3.60 = approx $5.04