Micheal Vick

I have been in a long standing debate on whether to bring back former Atlanta Falcons QB, Micheal Vick.

I have considered both sides of the story for a long time. What he did was wack, but I think the man has paid his dues to society.

I believe he is reformed and will probably never participate in dog fighting again; however, he will be the hated object of animal lover's everywhere, specifically the PETA organization.

Michael Vick has been recently released from prison and will probably be soon eligible for free agency. This is a unique opportunity for a lot of sub-par NFL teams to get a great quality (based on performance, less on character) quarterback at a cheap price.

I think Americans have a very hypocritical nature about themselves when it comes to issues of forgiveness. In my opinion, we should give the man a second chance... but not a third chance.

So, the million dollar question is: do you think Michael Vick should be re-instated to the NFL?

Vote now..!! (or later, whenever you get a chance)

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Originally Posted by The Brain

I have been in a long standing debate on whether to bring back former Atlanta Hawks QB, Micheal Vick.

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Cboard has a football team! Awesome...maybe we should invite Jack the Ripper to play safety.

He should be suspended for a certain amount of time (no more than a year) and then be allowed back if a team wants him.

There's more to the decision for a team than getting a quality player. First, Vick's style doesn't necessarily fit with every team's style (although with the expanded use of the Wildcat he might have more use to some teams than before). Second, the baggage that comes with might be more than he's worth. Many teams don't want the publicity and drama as well as the negative fan reaction that go along with signing convicted felons.

But I guess that's why he's cheap. My guess is that somebody out there will give him a chance. Maybe not this year but at least for next season. He'll be a big story for awhile and then not as much when he doesn't play much right away.

What was the argument against allowing him back in?

PETA hates him? *votes yes*

What do you guys think of this discussion on how to repair Micheal Vick's image?

NFL Videos: Repairing Vick's image

Compare to this video, which is reminiscent to the days of the KKK: YouTube - Michael Vick Worthless Jersey...

I didn't wanna say this before but DOGFIGHTING is beyond sick. I could care less whether "Micheal" Vick is allowed to play again (he's done his time and that's fair, it should not be held against him).

Still torn: I *COULD NOT* forgive this man for the same reasons that I empathize with those hell bent on permanently exposing sexual predators when they want to relocate next to an elementary school. Sure, let him play and have a career -- which means you do not have to have *any* moral credibility as an NFL professional. Who cares? So what kind of role model is the football player:

I make a million bucks, I kufc U up. Bottom line.

Sorry dude -- if you are repentant, find another job and work at repentance. Beyond that, I could care less. I could and would kill a man like this where he stands and not give a tish. Since he finds that style of fighting entertaining, I don't see where he would find room to object morally to the way he was being treated.

Let me ask you this.. a man kills a fellow teammate and a passenger whilst driving drunk.. and gets a fine, probation, and continues to play in the NFL today. Is this fair to Michael Vick who served prison time and may possibly be banished from ever playing in the NFL again?

I didn't watch the YouTube link, so my apologies if the answer was there, but who is making the argument that Vick should be banned from the league and what is their reasoning?

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Originally Posted by The Brain

Let me ask you this.. a man kills a fellow teammate and a passenger whilst driving drunk.. and gets a fine, probation, and continues to play in the NFL today. Is this fair to Michael Vick who served prison time and may possibly be banished from ever playing in the NFL again?

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Being drunk was irresponsible, the death(and the passenger being there) was incidental. There was no malice. The guy could have been pulled over for a DUI, but still drove home without incident. I guess he got got off lightly because the law only applied to the DUI.

From Wikipedia: "Vick was identified in April 2007 as "the key figure" of an extensive unlawful interstate dogfighting ring operating over a period of five years".

There is clearly malice and brutality here. Defenseless animals were killed or maimed for entertainment, and money. There must have been a high level of organization if it was an interestate operation. Animals were born, bred and incited to kill each other. This dogfighting ring could have spawned others, or be a template upon which others were built, and are still operating. So it perpretrated the cruelty to animals.

Being banished from the NFL is the least of his problems. :mad:

The guys an .............., the world is full of ..............s, but there's no need to turn him back into an .............. with money.

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Originally Posted by The Brain

I have been in a long standing debate on whether to bring back former Atlanta Hawks QB, Micheal Vick.

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First of all, it's the Atlanta Falcons, and his name is Michael Vick.

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I think Americans have a very hypocritical nature about themselves when it comes to issues of forgiveness.

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All 300 million of us? Can I borrow your broad brush to paint my house this weekend?

According to the video on repairing Vick's image, Marshall Faulk states that he'll probably never see big money again if he is re-instated to the NFL. That said, we'll have a man that will be playing for pride.. which is kinda refreshing in a league of money driven million dollar players. Playing for pride is something used to only see in college football.

Solomon Wilcots states that this could be a unique opportunity for at least 16 of the 32 NFL teams who might be interested in Vick to improve their quarterback situation.. at a discount price.

Allow me to pose another question: Is dog fighting part of a different culture than what you are used to? Also, how does it differ from other events such as cock fighting and bull fighting which both result in the death of animals for the purposes of human entertainment?

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Originally Posted by The Brain

According to the video on repairing Vick's image, Marshall Faulk states that he'll probably never see big money again if he is re-instated to the NFL.

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Define "big money." I personally find the $285,000 minimum salary in the NFL to be pretty big money as it is.

My feeling is that I could care less whether or not he returns. I take great offense to the dog fighting that he was involved in, however, it would be truly hypocritical to single him out among a group of people such as the NFL players. It seems like it's 2-3 times a year that I'm hearing about a player's gun being used in a shooting or they're involved in some other kind of felony. I'm not calling all NFL players criminals, I'm just saying that among the super-rich "allegedly" can stay "allegedly" for as long as the "alleged" can pass money under the tables. Vick got singled out because rather than it just being a shooting or an assault, it was something unique. Something that got the attention of specific interest groups that have fairly deep pockets themselves. Once the media gets that deep of a hold, it's hard to take bribes. That's why Vick got put away... however, I really have trouble acting like he did something worse than so many in the NFL would or have done. I mean, how can you put that much on the guy when blogs like this have dozens of entries per month.

I really don't think the NFL's problem's have anything to do with the money, I think its their de facto recruiting policy of ignoring personality defects like lack of emotional maturity, poor self control, and lack of a strong moral compass (whatever that means). Basically they recruit based entirely on in game performance, which is obviously a major factor, but the role of NFL players involves much more than just winnign games. These people are acting as role models for millions of kids, and if they can't exhibit behavior that is appropriate for that role, they really don't need to put on a pedistal. Now this isn't entirely the NFL's fault, the sports reporting community is also culpable, as they cchoose which players to highlight, and media popularity is a major factor in the money an athlete makes.

But sinc the average NFL fan is a drooling idiot that couldnt care less, or worse enjoys watching evil nitwits, they get what they ask for. That's why I don't watch sports anymore.

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Originally Posted by abachler

These people are acting as role models for millions of kids, and if they can't exhibit behavior that is appropriate for that role, they really don't need to put on a pedistal. Now this isn't entirely the NFL's fault, the sports reporting community is also culpable, as they cchoose which players to highlight, and media popularity is a major factor in the money an athlete makes.

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That kids look up to nitwit role models instead of their parents is overwhelmingly the fault of the parents.

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Originally Posted by medievalelks

That kids look up to nitwit role models instead of their parents is overwhelmingly the fault of the parents.

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Why? Are you blaming parents for not being multimillionaires and tremendously talented at their profession or trade?

It's human nature to idolize success. The greatest levels of success doesn't always come from those closest to you. The only thing you can blame for human nature is evolution or god, depending on your stance... that is if you really want to blame something for the mental drive that can account for nearly all of human's advancements since the beginning of the species.

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Originally Posted by SlyMaelstrom

Why? Are you blaming parents for not being multimillionaires and tremendously talented at their profession or trade?

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No, I'm blaming them for not raising their children with the right values and/or spending enough time with them.

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It's human nature to idolize success.

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Really? Seems to me people enjoy tearing down the successful in the name of some misguided notion of "equality"

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Originally Posted by abachler

These people are acting as role models for millions of kids, and if they can't exhibit behavior that is appropriate for that role, they really don't need to put on a pedistal. Now this isn't entirely the NFL's fault, the sports reporting community is also culpable, as they cchoose which players to highlight, and media popularity is a major factor in the money an athlete makes.

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It is the fans that are culpable, and obviously they are comfortable enough with the situation to continue buying tickets. The NFL doesn't need to arbitrate morality. If society feels that someone that did what Micheal Vick did only deserves a year or whatever, while

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Originally Posted by Blog mentioned by SlyMaelstrom

Former NFL running back Travis Henry pleaded guilty Thursday to trafficking cocaine in a federal drug case that could land him in prison for 10 years or more.

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then *very obviously* American society has a totally whacked sense of "justice", and a "moral compass" without a needle. I do not see why the football league should (or would want) to start taking stands on ethics in that context; the most they will end up doing is mirroring the general perversity.

kids have cartoon network and video games, they don't watch sports. The days of role models are over

Let me throw out a couple more nuggets for ye' to mentally chew on:

To what extent can PETA and others determine Vick's career? Assuming they do not wish him to return to NFL football, then what is he allowed to do to earn a living? The man has to support for his family some how... is he allowed to work for McDonalds? Will PETA (and others) condemn McDonalds for supporting animal abuse?

If a U.S. President lies under oath, yet is allowed to continue his Presidency... can an NFL player return to the field if he lies to his boss? (not under oath.. but still a substantial character flaw)

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Originally Posted by The Brain

To what extent can PETA and others determine Vick's career?

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To whatever extent they can. Again, going back to the parallel with released rapists, that is exactly what happens. It does seem slightly unfair that, after someone has paid their official debt to society, they are then subject to having their house highlighted on an online map and their name on a public list. On the other hand, this is somewhat understandable; if I had kids walking around my neighbourhood, I would want to know who the convicted pedophiles are. If that has negative consequences for them, oh well.

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Originally Posted by MK27

if I had kids walking around my neighbourhood, I would want to know who the convicted pedophiles are. If that has negative consequences for them, oh well.

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Then the core concept is preventing potential harm to vixtims if the offender repeats his crime. Therefor, by that argument, Vick shouldnt be banned from the NFL but he should be banned from going within 1000 feet of a dog.

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Originally Posted by abachler

Then the core concept is preventing potential harm to vixtims if the offender repeats his crime. Therefor, by that argument, Vick shouldnt be banned from the NFL but he should be banned from going within 1000 feet of a dog.

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I would actually support that

Voted undecided. It's entirely up to the discretion of the league, like hiring a felon always is to the employer, in any career ever. Wouldn't personally offend me if he played, but so help me if my opinion matters.