Thread: Must be final project time again....

Having thought more about this (and considering the context of the past couple of days worth of msgs combined with issues plaguing students that I recall) I realized that *sometimes* students are not being lazy but just cannot figure out how to get started. Its like they are given the task of (say) mapping radio tower usage and really don't get the higher-level design part for it and so they come here asking for code. This is still wrong but I think if there was a thread they could post "How do I solve problem X" where X could be a simple data structure to a menu system to larger design problems, we who have solved these things before can give design/architecture hints, none of which involve source code; that would be left to the user. If this higher level of design wisdom was not of value, the whole concept of design patterns would have died out years ago...

Originally Posted by Sebastiani

There's nothing wrong with being lazy...as long as you don't expect someone else to do the work for you.

What really irks me, though, are the ones that don't even know the very *basics* of the language, and yet they want you to help them design a compiler or something!

Code:

void main()
{
	char s="". // <- how i make compiler wit thiis?!!!
}

Yes like that dude who claimed to know C and wanted a system made for him to parse *any* graphics file for a blue pixel...and then could not even follow the basic directions for installing the library to do it. Made worse by the fact that before he did it we (myself and MK for sure) told him that such and such library was big and feature complete but will require a lot of learning on his part...and so he selects the hardest to use library, after stating he could not understand the instructions for installing it (it came with a visual C++ project; all he had to do was hit the build button)...he tells us to just give him the code to do it, the libraries were all too hard for him..

I mean no matter how charitably you look at it, there is something seriously wrong with this picture. I was joking with MK about it, noting that most of these kinds of requests come from people with handles like Genius or KodeMasterOfTheUniverse or some such rot...

Originally Posted by MK27

The reason I spoke up was because the second post in this thread was jdragyn suggesting that we make a policy of mocking and intentionally lying to such people outright.

Actually, I made no suggestion that it be policy, and I did say "performs as intended", just "obviously way above the skill of the poster". Nor did I expect anyone to jump on any such bandwagon and support the idea in anything other than what it was intended: an obviously over-the-top reaction to the phenomenon Bubba was observing.

Originally Posted by MK27

since there has been some support for this idea here before.

Was not aware of this. I most certainly would not have suggested it, even (apparently no-so) humorously, if I had been aware of this. Guess I'm guilty of not searching for my problem before posting...

I apologize to Bubba for causing his observation to be turned into an argument, and I apologize to everyone else for apparently shouting "Fire" in a crowded movie theater.

Final project time? What!? It's only Winter here... and half way through the academic year!.

Originally Posted by MK27

WRT to "doing homework", I wasn't suggesting that be cast aside or anything. And I do ignore posters according to my mood if they seem too disinterested in making an effort themselves.

That's a bit like "ATM machine" .

Yes, the "I'll show you how it's done" replies that some people seem to insist on giving -- perhaps to prove their "1337ness" frustrate me. As much as the "I can't be bothered learning, give me the codes.". Or the focus being that the programming is the biggest problem, rather than the method for intelligently solving the problem. That's why I think a lot of practical assessments fail, with no SE methodologies students seem to degrade to hacking until an answer comes out -- or ask on a forum such as this.

Originally Posted by zacs7

Or the focus being that the programming is the biggest problem, rather than the method for intelligently solving the problem. That's why I think a lot of practical assessments fail, with no SE methodologies students seem to degrade to hacking until an answer comes out -- or ask on a forum such as this.

I think I can appreciate what you are saying. I haven't formally studied "SE methodologies" but it has often occurred to me that some kind of uniform approach to presenting modularity as fundamental (for example) would benefit a lot of problem cases. I suppose it is implicit in the use of functions, classes, etc, but perhaps "implicit" is not always enough and this reflects some laziness on behalf of "the establishment" (I have mixed feelings about the quality of much or most programming related documentation, honestly).

Vis. obfuscation, the jEssYcAt thing had me in bellowing stitches. WRT my claim "there has been some support for this idea here before" (intentionally sabotaging cut n' pasters) you know I love y'all (blush) but you'll have to live with yerselves on that -- please grow up