Can somebody please explain to me what CLI is?
When I write a C++ program with CLI it will be compiled by a C++/CLI compiler to a code different from a pure C++ compiler? Does it add overheads to the code?
What is managed code?
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Can somebody please explain to me what CLI is?
When I write a C++ program with CLI it will be compiled by a C++/CLI compiler to a code different from a pure C++ compiler? Does it add overheads to the code?
What is managed code?
Managed C++ is a way to combine C++ code with .NET. To compile the programs you had with VC 6, you should pick Win32 projects, not .NET projects so you don't have to deal with CLI or managed code. You can also turn off the option in the project properties.
So C++ is still C++? I don't have CLI compiler yet.
With a .NET compiler (VC++ version 7.0 or greater, 2002 or higher) you can compile regular C++ without the CLI features. You can also do it with the CLI. It is your choice. Most of the people in this forum don't use the CLI, so generally the code we write here would belong in Win32 projects instead of .NET projects, which is what I was referring to earlier.
I'm on VS.NET 2003. That calls this common language runtime - with the comiler option /clr. I only noticed it yesterday, but after switching it off my binary went down from 22 to 2MB and runtimes have increased between 5x (at the very slowest) and 100x (averaging about 80x speed increase). God knows why. I wasn't even using any managed extension code. :rolleyes:
vs.net 2002/3 don't support the full version of C++/CLI. CLI actually adds extra operators to the language (using ^ as a garbage-collected "handle", instead of a pointer). vs 2002/3 support "managed c++" which is an ugly hack to get .net support in C++. if you want to interoperate between C++ and .net, my advice is to get vs 2005.
Although I can't speak from personal experience, from what I've heard C++/CLI is actually quite nice to use.
New posts came when I was writing this post :D .
I understood that we can write C++ code in C++/CLI environment. But can somebody please explain to me what CLI is? Is it something like Java VM?
Can Micro$oft force programmers to write only .net/CLI code for windows in the future?
I like C++ because I know what I am doing and it does what I've told it. But with CLI you don't know what is going on.
Micro$oft said "CLI is very efficient, C++, C#, VB, etc will work at the same speed because they all will use CLI.". Yes because all of them will work as slow as a BASIC code on an 386 machine. If somebody want to write CLI she can go for C# or VB. What C++/CLI means to exist?
Microsoft also said "Creating C++/CLI from C++ is like creating C++ from C.". What do you think?
Since Microsoft controls Windows, not Micro$oft (whoever they are), Micro$oft will never be able to force you to use .NET/CLI instead of native Win32 (or Win64 at that time).
Of course Microsoft could decide to drop Win32/Win64 support from the operating system, but they'd be shooting themselves in the foot as it would prevent the vast majority of existing applications (including many of their own) from working anymore.
You can still run 16 bit Windows and even DOS applications in Windows XP today, applications written 10-20 years ago.
I'd not worry overly much about some evil genius stealing Windows and changing it so that everything that's not a .NET assembly fails to work.
I don't know about Win64, but there is something named WinFX. I don't know how it works exactly. But Micro$oft likes to do the hard part of programming for programmers and tries to make things very easy for programmers. It satisfies at least two goals:
1) All developers will be more dependent to Micro$oft.
2) Micro$oft can handle the compatibility problems and bugs more easily.
Running old programs has nothing to do with my problem (Does Vista support them?). What if microsoft realesed a C++/CLI compiler that only supported .net? Yes their OS will still support Win32, but because many programmers use Microsoft compilers, they wont produce a non-CLI code. So after 6 years from that time, Micy can make an OS without support of Win32, Win64, WinFX, etc. Only CLI and .net are supported then.
What do you mean?Quote:
I'd not worry overly much about some evil genius stealing Windows and changing it so that everything that's not a .NET assembly fails to work.
what Micy does equally doesn't matter...
It's only what Microsoft does that matters.
Their compilers now haven't supported DOS for over a decade yet you can still run DOS programs on the latest version of Windows...
Your support for piracy is only outstripped by your hatred for Microsoft it seems yet you still insist in using their products.
If you hate them so much be a man and do without their products.
you know, as soon as you said "Micro$oft", I lost all interest in helping you.
get off your ass, go to msdn and RTFM! then come back a little more educated.
I don't hate Microsoft, I like it. If there was no Microsoft there was no PC I think. But it sometimes do some works just for keeping it's supriority. It is good to read:
http://www.madore.org/~david/computers/antims.html
Yes, it is exactly what I said. There can be support for Win32, but no support for developing it.Quote:
Their compilers now haven't supported DOS for over a decade yet you can still run DOS programs on the latest version of Windows...
Becareful of what you are saying I don't support any kind of piracy. I am not happy that there is no copyright law here because it is bad for a developer. I wish you understand this.Quote:
Your support for piracy is only outstripped by your hatred for Microsoft it seems yet you still insist in using their products.
yet you're using software which you under US export restrictions should have no access to... That means that software must be pirated and you must know that.
Your attempts to be seen as a 1337 k3w1 hax0r also don't make you look better...
This is US export restriction not Iran import restriction.
What is 1337 k3w1 hax0r then?
Just had to comment this...Quote:
Originally Posted by jwenting
Programmers are forced to be with Microsofts products.
I do hate them so much that you can't describe it...
I do call them M$ & Micro$oft.
But I have to use Windows 'cause could I make & compile & ship C++ Win32 programs under *nix based OSes ? don't think so.
And If I don't make programs for Windows my public with decrease with about 70%+.
If I could use Linux for Mac OS X & Win32 programs I'd change instantly to Linux but I can't...
that's total bollox. C++ is an open standard. You can develop nice portable C++ using cross platform libraries and toolkits (boost, wxwidgets, xerces) on linux or mac and then just build a windows version. If you decide to write code using MFC or win32 that's your problem, but don't go blaming microsoft. If you don't like them, fair enough (and there are certainly valid reasons for disliking microsoft), but every time I read M$, I mentally picture a star trek geek screaming "Curse you M$! from my parents basement in wyoming, I stab at thee!" (thanks, penny arcade)Quote:
Originally Posted by lord mazdak
Chaos, you can develop your program in *nix based with wrapper libiraries.
But can you compile the code for Windows OSes without Windows ?
Correct me if I'm wrong but you'll have make the code & when its done you transfer the code to a "Windows PC" and then compile it and then transfer back.
And if you were to make enterprise appz , would you seriously make it for windows totaly with wrappers?
And without testing it ?
It may be possible to cross compile from a given platform to MS Windows.Quote:
But can you compile the code for Windows OSes without Windows ?
If I hated them so much I'd refuse to even use their products to make a living.
There's more than enough jobs out there where you'll never use a Microsoft product at all if you don't want to.
You're just lazy not looking for them and lacking in principle and backbone.
You also show yourself to be just a little kid who never thought for himself but just wants to look like a 1337 k3w1 hax0r by repeating the /. party line.
All things have some good and bad aspects. Nothing is absolute. Microsoft or just for fun Micro$oft has its own good and bad aspects. Anywhere I'll be, if I have the enough money I will buy Windows because I only used Windows and it became a habit (what Microsoft wants).
Quality of Microsoft products is good. But Microsoft strategy is another thing, which I don't want to discuss here.
This thread is not for fighting on Micro$oft. If I write Micro$oft, you write Microsoft and don't get sad. I keep my idea, you keep yours. It is named freedom.
I don't think so. Though, I want to use their products because Microsoft is de facto of standard.Quote:
There are more than enough jobs out there where you'll never use a Microsoft product at all if you don't want to.
I don't know what 1337... is.
CLOSED
This thread as become a slanging match.