What can I do?

[Unregistered]

I am crying my heart out after looking at my exam grade for "Data Structures." My professor scribbled comments like " Nothing sensible here (in my paper)," "What the heck are you printing for?" and "Completely unrelated and not done right anyway !!!!(sarcasm)." Am I being too sensitive or is he a little mean in his comments? I need advice on what I should do to improve myself in C++?

I am actually a 4.0 GPA student who has made the president's list for the past three semesters. No big deal except to say that I am not that academically challenged. But for some reason, C++ has not click for me yet. I read my textbook (more than once) like I am supposed to and do whatever programming assignment that's given. When it comes to the actual task of writing programs, I go blank.

Sigh ! How come you guys do so well? Are my brains wired wrongly for C++? I take 2 days to write something that my friends take 10 mins....Throw me some nuggets of wisdom please?

[moemen ahmed]

read C++ code as much a u can, and try to rewrite it by yourslef
this ll make u used to the archetecure of C++ programming and will give you good point to start with each time you r trying to write something in c++, dont lose the hope its always there

good luck !

[SilentStrike]

Have you done a lot of math type stuff? Programming is just rational thinking, breaking problems into smaller problems, etc.

Relax, take a step back, and try to see the big picture behind stuff before getting lost in the details.

[master5001]

I hate to say it but some people just don't have an aptitude for programming. They can force themselves to learn syntax and techniques that would make one "technically" a programmer however, some just don't really want to do it. I knew c, c++, java, perl, python, html, javascript, and a little assembler by the time I finished high school. The only programming class I took in high school was java. And by then I already knew perl, html, and javascript from reading tutorials on the internet. If you don't want to do it you won't be able to. If you want to program, truly, it will click. As for suggestions, write a calculator program. It is really not a lot of work. And by the time you finish you should be well on your way to acing your c++ class.

[endo]

You'll find it'll click at some point, and you'll wonder why it was so hard before. Try taking on a reasonably large project, you'll learn lots overcoming the problems you'll encounter.

One more thing, my coding has improved loads from hanging around on forums like this one. I know so much more than I did when I finished studying

[Unregistered]

I agree with "endo"

but

>>I hate to say it but some people just don't have an aptitude for programming

>>I knew c, c++, java, perl, python, html, javascript, and a little assembler by the time I finished high school.

this guy really wants to show himself big (and I know he's going to react to this post of mine... anyway) no offence to him, but
people lacking in aptitude is something i don't believe in.

your next statement...

>>If you don't want to do it you won't be able to
this part, i agree... but the aptitude part... i dont!

that's what they said about black pilots during world war 2.
"black people just don't have tha aptitude for flying."
they even "proved" it using psychologists (naturally, white men)

but it turns out that there was a black fighter jet team that
did not lose a single fighter jet in ALL their missions. but they
never gave them any kind of honour. good bless USA ???
anyway, that's a lot of diversion..

don't worry, every 4.0 student knows the importance of hardwork. and i am sure you do. all you need is a little more
practice along with some patience.

[endo]

If 4.0 is a good score (I'm not in the US), then I'm sure you wont have too much trouble once you get the hang of it. Btw your professor sounds a bit harsh - maybe you should ask his advice on exactly what was so bad and how best to improve it.

Ignore what others say, anyone can be a programmer as long as they want to be. Same as anything else, if you dont want it you wont get it and vice versa.

Anyway, just my words of wisdom for the day

[raimo]

I agree with "endo"
but
>>I hate to say it but some people just don't have an aptitude for programming
>>I knew c, c++, java, perl, python, html, javascript, and a little assembler by the time I finished high school.
this guy really wants to show himself big (and I know he's going to react to this post of mine... anyway) no offence to him, but
people lacking in aptitude is something i don't believe in.

I partly agree. Almost anyone can learn how to program. At least in some stage.. But they have to have some motivation to do that. Most of the good programmers have begun coding at a very young age and NOT at school. You should have some motivation to code more than just that "doing your assignments".

This has something to do with the issue:
http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/faqs/hacker-howto.html

[kas2002]

aptitude? whatever
if are any good at logicial thinking then programing should come easy to you. You obviously are good at thinking logically becasue it is not a easy task to be good any every subject and not just a few which I guilty of. Not because I don't have the aptitude but becasue I don't have the compassion (I am also known to be a little lazy) like any other subject you are interested in C++ just takes a little grasping of a few basic concepts and you should be on your way to learning it

[Uraldor]

Greetings People.

I have a few things I'd like to say.

Firstly to 'Unregistered'.

As has already been said, you probably find a lot of things easy, but other things really do come hard. You can't be good at everything! It's really as simple as that. If you have enough drive, and enough determination it will hopefully get to the stage where you can sit down and program without having to strain over the problem for days.

Yes, I do think that your teacher was harsh in his comments. As a teacher myself, I really do hate it when other teachers make such comments to students. Teachers aren't just there to teach students, they are supposed to motivate them and make them feel good in what they are studying so they will strive to do better. Obviously this teacher of yours doesn't really know the first thing about keeping students motivated, and probably goes home on the weekends and wears his wife's lingerie on his head (j/k).

But remember this: "A good student learns in spite of the teacher". If you think you can do it, then prove to him that you can, no matter what crappy comments he gives you on your papers! Get in there and give it all you've got, and you'll prove to him that you can do it.

To Moemen Ahmed:

To a point i agree with what you are saying. I think that reading code is a good way to get a feel for how to come up with some solutions, but ultimately reading isn't going to do you any good compared to actually doing. I say this to quite a few of my students, it doesnt' matter how many books you read, how many snippets of code you read, or how many times you read them. If you dont DO anything yourself then you are never going to learn. So yes, reading and rewriting stuff yourself is a good excercise, but writing it yourself from the start without reading someone else's code is a better way! If you can't solve the problem without having to look at other people's solutions, then as far as I'm concerned you're as useful as a chocolate teapot as far as coding is concerned.

To SilentStrike:

I agree. Programming is very maths-based, but the biggest part of the role is problem solving. You can teach anyone the syntax of code, but it doesn't mean that they are going to be able to use that language as a tool to produce a solution to a problem. If you can't understand and solve the problem in your head, you'll never be able to implement it in your code.

To master5001:

I agree with your statement about aptitude. But keep in mind that aptitute does cover quite a variety of areas. He is right, there are many people out there who just don't have what it takes to be a programmer. This links back to SilentStrike's comments about problem solving. If you're not a natural problem solver, you will struggle! It's as simple as that.

I'm sure everyone is impressed, but it's probably not necessary for you to give us your resume. It doesn't matter how many languages you can code in. If you are a true programmer you'll pick up a language in no time. Language is just a flavour..... it's the contents of the drink that make the difference.

I have quite a few people ask me what languages i know.. and i often give them the answer "It doesn't matter how many i know. I'm a programmer, and will be able to give you a solution in any language". Sure, I might not know the syntax of the language, but it won't take long to pick up if you know the programming techniques employed in almost every kind of programming language.

To Endo:

You are right too. If this 'unregistered' character does have the aptitude for programming, then he'll wake up one morning and the penny will drop. Sometimes it actually does the person good to get away from their problem or the computer for a while to clear the head. And when they come back to it they realise just how easy it was from the very start.

I do disagree with your comment about anyone being a programmer. That's absolute crap. It takes a certain kind of mind to be able to take on programming and do well with it. ANYONE can learn syntax, not everyone can learn to solve problems and be able to provide a solution in the language that they know the syntax of. If you really believe anyone can do it, then i think you're labouring under a misaprehension. There is no way that everyone could be a programmer just because they want to.

Unregistered again:

Your comments about the black pilots are valid, but i can't see how this relates to the current discussion. The comment about aptitude was referring to 'some people', not to a particular group of people. It was a general statement that meant that any person, male, female, black, white, yellow, young, old, etc MAY NOT have the aptitude for it. It was extremely general and not focussed on any one group of people, which means that the statement is indeed valid and has nothing to do with what other people have said.

Raimo:

IMHO you are wrong. I would have agreed if you had said "Almost anyone can learn a programming language". Let's not forget that being a programmer isn't just be able to cut code, there is a lot more to it than that.

kas2002:

I'm assuming you meant "if you are any good at logical thinking then programming should come easy to you". That's true, but if you think that aptitude has nothing to do with the way people learn, and take things on then you are very much mistaken.

Everyone:

On the whole, deep down you know whether you've got what it takes to be good in a programming role. And if you believe in yourself enough, you will achieve what you set out to achieve no matter what other people say or do.

Finally to answer one of the original questions:

How come you guys do so well?
Practice. Don't be scared to make mistakes, often making mistakes is the best way to learn. Those people on the board that are doing well have most likely been coding for a very long time and have learned the process of trial and error while coding. It really does play a big part in learning. Keep reading, keep coding, keep trying and keep posting... it'll come eventually. Remember, it's better to sit down with a pen and paper, think about the problem and write things down before even looking at your computer! Jumping straight into code may make things harder for you.

Thanks for listening to my rant

good luck to you all!
U.

[onurak]

look i agree with master5001 on the fýrst page he saýd some people just can't write programs i think that true becouse programming is not lýke maths maths has sum rules you cant go further but in programýng you make the rules in my idea a hard working man cant be a good programmer becouse all hard working man s take what you gýve them they dont ask why this happen like this. so thats my idea

[Hershlag]

It's more the love than the brains. You have to love it or you won't stand a chance. I don't think master 5001 was trying to be that harsh. Be easy on him. Coding is difficult. It's not like taking a history or english course, you have to submerge yourself in the subject, become a programmer. You can't just learn it in a class. If you can't make that commitment (and I'm not sure you should for a single class) then you probably shouldn't be taking that class.

Again, 4.0 gradepoint average is a testament to your intelligence and hard work. I never had that motivation for other courses but I LIVED C++. To each his own.

[skipper]

(Boy, this is really designed for the General Discussions board, isn't it?)

A 4.0 student. I'm impressed with the accomplishment, not the mindset.

A 4.0 student wants, more than anything, to remain a 4.0 student. No room for failure. Everything must come perfectly within a 16-week course. (Adjust course duration as necessary.)

Is 'Unregistered' a Computer Science major, or an Engineering major? (Engineering majors may well be required to take C++, though it's collateral to their chosen "discipline". Does this make a difference? You bet your last dollar, it does! Anyone who doesn't understand this should skip to the next thread.)

We've gone way off the mark here, ladies and gentlemen.

Unregistered is a student who fell flat on his/her fanny. (Who of us haven't?)

His/her 4.0 GPA is in jeopardy, and, now, we're asked to arrive at a solution to his/her dilemma.

I've always felt that Prelude's admonition to the Board that, "We're not here to make you feel good about yourself", was, shall we say, less-than-warm, however...

There are people who can conceptualize a solution to a problem, with, or without, the tools. There are, also, people, with all of the tools, who can't come up with a solution to anything. Go figure.

P.S. Other Unregistered's analogy/comparison to Black individuals during the Second World War is invalid. (Sorry, Uraldor.)

Those individuals weren't given the opportunity, initially. Their "aptitude" was pre-judged. Wrongly, I might add.

This student had the same opportunity as his/her classmates to demonstrate his/her knowledge, and grasp, of the subject matter. That didn't happen.

-Skipper

[Unregistered]

what i meant with the black people story is that
there are idiots out there who say that "some people"
don't have the aptitude for certain things.

it doesn't matter who that "some people" refers to.
they indirectly say it and then say, "it's ok,.. it's
not your fault.. some people just don't have the
aptitude"

well F*** them.

show interest and hardwork, and everyone will succeed.

Genius is 99 % perspiration and 1 % inspiration..

aptitude talk is bull ..........!!!

[Jeex]

Unregistered again:

Your comments about the black pilots are valid, but i can't see how this relates to the current discussion. The comment about aptitude was referring to 'some people', not to a particular group of people. It was a general statement that meant that any person, male, female, black, white, yellow, young, old, etc MAY NOT have the aptitude for it. It was extremely general and not focussed on any one group of people, which means that the statement is indeed valid and has nothing to do with what other people have said.

there's absolutely no need of aptitude when you
have hardwork in your hands..