Heaven, Hell, and Aetheists/Non-believers

Aran · 09-07-2001, 04:15 PM

I was wondering what you all think about this:

do aetheist/non-believers go to hell when they die? why? how?

if someone does no believe in hell, how can they go there? to them, it doesn't exist, so it doesn't and they can't go there. I don't see how hell can exist if people know it doesn't. Most of religion is a "just because." situation because it is unexplainable and makes no sence. I think that the cristian/catholic church should just say that all science is completely wrong, because sooner or later cristianity is going to end because of the scientists. Although we won't find all the ansers we are looking for, we'll find enough to stop believing in the literal translation of something metaphorical (which is stupid, and is why i dislike catholicism/christianity)...

i am an aetheist, btw.

what are your views?

feel free to flame me if this offends you as a catholic/christian; i can fight you at any turn and win.

gordy · 09-07-2001, 04:27 PM

hehe, the last religion discussion went like widfire so i'm lining up with you aran against the "i can't work out m own morals so i'll use someone elses" club.

Nick · 09-07-2001, 04:51 PM

Quote:

if someone does no believe in hell, how can they go there? to them, it doesn't exist, so it doesn't and they can't go there. I don't see how hell can exist if people know it doesn't.

Atoms existed and people used to think otherwise. It's quite concievable

that hell is in another world.

Can we really stop this debate wasn't the last one enough?

BTW if you were really atheist why would you want to convince
me to become an atheist?

Theologian · 09-07-2001, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Aran Elus
I was wondering what you all think about this:
if someone does no believe in hell, how can they go there?

This is really a rather silly question.

If someone does not believe in gravity will they fall? How could they if they don't believe?

Because if something exists, it does- regardless of one's opinion in regards to that thing. This is true of any reality.

Whether or not you or I believe in hell is irrelevant to whether or not it exists.

The rest of the thread is just gonna go downhill fast- but I couldn't resist this little bit.

Nick · 09-07-2001, 04:58 PM

Quote:

i'm lining up with you aran against the "i can't work out m own morals so i'll use someone elses" club.

A statement which contradicts its self.

ehsiq · 09-07-2001, 05:02 PM

the last time we talked about religion was...wow...anyway.
Aran Elus i am an atheist too.
still there are some points in your theory that are not correct
as Theologian said. still there are other explanations about
atheism. anyway, without going like the other time, who of
you ppl are atheist? (answer with a yes and a no only)???

ehsiq · 09-07-2001, 05:04 PM

hm...sorry if i change your thread.

Aran · 09-07-2001, 05:07 PM

(in response to nick)
it most definately does not, although it is slightly misworded.

he is talking about how catholicism/christianity sets up the morals and the rules for the people to follow without question in order to make them feel like they are 'doing the right thing'.

Christianiy/Catholicism is just a way that some people try to deny their past and look toward a future that will boomerange them when it comes because their beliefs make them backwards. It's a strange effect, but it's what this religion ends up leading to. If you deny your past, where will your future lead?

ohh, and, hell, by nature, is not 'another world', it wouldn't be able to be 'another world'. If it actually does exist it would exist on an alternate plane or dimension of earth or the universe. But i see hell as the hammer that you are threatened with but that doesn't actually exist. It is a tool to keep the members of the religion in line, for, without it, there would be no reason not to sin. It's a very ugly way that christianity/catholicism works and it taps into the primal side of humans while it denies it: this is a very big mistake and will cause catastrophe if not mended soon.

I have no problem with catholics/christians and i do not wish them to become an aetheist if they use their religion as their backbone and draw strength from it (like i did once). It's a matter of sence, of which catholicism/christianity is making less and less

Aran · 09-07-2001, 05:12 PM

maybe instead of having a conversation like

"Hey, i'm an aetheist"
"I am too"
"you going to go to hell because you don't believe in god"
"What if i don't believe in it?"
blahblahblah...

we should just discuss the weaknesses of religion and how to design the best possible one. Now that i see how this board is going to take my ideas, i've decided it's best not to delve to deep, there. (and, btw, i haven't seen any past religion-related threads here.. well, maybe one, but i don't believe i participated.)

Pendragon · 09-07-2001, 05:22 PM

In my opinion religion is a disease that clouds judgement and forces invisible barriers between people.
More wars have been fought over religion than over anything.
Nearly all religions have their *morals* but they all go to scabe when another religion disagrees with them. They *think* they're doing the best thing by their standards whilst totally throwing their morals out of the mswindow.

But that's just me...

Aran · 09-07-2001, 05:27 PM

wow, that's exactly what i was going to write if someone responded futher on the original track of this discussion.

heh, religion is a blinder, pure and simple.

Pendragon · 09-07-2001, 05:31 PM

Great minds think alike....

Hopefully noone will be offended by my spontaneous outburst. They usually are...

Pendragon · 09-07-2001, 05:39 PM

It's a shame really...

Generator · 09-07-2001, 06:04 PM

I think religion was created as a way to control lower class society back in the day. The upper class were scared there were more poor people than them and said "hey what if we made them believe in this, they wont come kill us eat our stuff and take our money." and thus began religion. A way to control society by playing with their beliefs. Of course I could be wrong...

Nick · 09-07-2001, 06:53 PM

I was kind of joking, though it sounds like he was doing that "me too thing". Atheistism is just has much a religion as christanity. I love how athiest think they are "rebels". It's interesting because why would anyone want to convince anyone to be Atheist?

Hell is interpreted in different ways, fire and brim stone, just
seperation from God. It's not really dwelt on in the bible.

Quote:

hh, and, hell, by nature, is not 'another world', it wouldn't be able to be 'another world'. If it actually does exist it would exist on an alternate plane or dimension of earth or the universe. But i see hell as the hammer that you are threatened with but that doesn't actually exist. It is a tool to keep the members of the religion in line, for, without it, there would be no reason not to sin. It's a very ugly way that christianity/catholicism works and it taps into the primal side of humans while it denies it: this is a very big mistake and will cause catastrophe if not mended soon.

There is no scientific evidence to support or not to support the
view that there could be different universes with different
laws. It could be in this universe but perhaps in a different
galaxy, we would never be able to know. It is a different world
as we know it. Charity just to avoid hell is not a christen's belief. I'm not sure where you get the idea that christens threaten you with hell.

09-07-2001, 04:15 PM	#1
Aran Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 1,301	Heaven, Hell, and Aetheists/Non-believers I was wondering what you all think about this: do aetheist/non-believers go to hell when they die? why? how? if someone does no believe in hell, how can they go there? to them, it doesn't exist, so it doesn't and they can't go there. I don't see how hell can exist if people know it doesn't. Most of religion is a "just because." situation because it is unexplainable and makes no sence. I think that the cristian/catholic church should just say that all science is completely wrong, because sooner or later cristianity is going to end because of the scientists. Although we won't find all the ansers we are looking for, we'll find enough to stop believing in the literal translation of something metaphorical (which is stupid, and is why i dislike catholicism/christianity)... i am an aetheist, btw. what are your views? feel free to flame me if this offends you as a catholic/christian; i can fight you at any turn and win.
Aran is offline

09-07-2001, 04:27 PM	#2
gordy Registered User Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 48	hehe, the last religion discussion went like widfire so i'm lining up with you aran against the "i can't work out m own morals so i'll use someone elses" club. __________________ astride a storied past, thats everywhere you are
gordy is offline

09-07-2001, 05:02 PM	#6
ehsiq Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 89	the last time we talked about religion was...wow...anyway. Aran Elus i am an atheist too. still there are some points in your theory that are not correct as Theologian said. still there are other explanations about atheism. anyway, without going like the other time, who of you ppl are atheist? (answer with a yes and a no only)??? __________________ behold the faithless one and his angel
ehsiq is offline

09-07-2001, 05:04 PM	#7
ehsiq Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 89	hm...sorry if i change your thread. __________________ behold the faithless one and his angel
ehsiq is offline

09-07-2001, 05:07 PM	#8
Aran Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 1,301	(in response to nick) it most definately does not, although it is slightly misworded. he is talking about how catholicism/christianity sets up the morals and the rules for the people to follow without question in order to make them feel like they are 'doing the right thing'. Christianiy/Catholicism is just a way that some people try to deny their past and look toward a future that will boomerange them when it comes because their beliefs make them backwards. It's a strange effect, but it's what this religion ends up leading to. If you deny your past, where will your future lead? ohh, and, hell, by nature, is not 'another world', it wouldn't be able to be 'another world'. If it actually does exist it would exist on an alternate plane or dimension of earth or the universe. But i see hell as the hammer that you are threatened with but that doesn't actually exist. It is a tool to keep the members of the religion in line, for, without it, there would be no reason not to sin. It's a very ugly way that christianity/catholicism works and it taps into the primal side of humans while it denies it: this is a very big mistake and will cause catastrophe if not mended soon. I have no problem with catholics/christians and i do not wish them to become an aetheist if they use their religion as their backbone and draw strength from it (like i did once). It's a matter of sence, of which catholicism/christianity is making less and less
Aran is offline

09-07-2001, 05:12 PM	#9
Aran Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 1,301	maybe instead of having a conversation like "Hey, i'm an aetheist" "I am too" "you going to go to hell because you don't believe in god" "What if i don't believe in it?" blahblahblah... we should just discuss the weaknesses of religion and how to design the best possible one. Now that i see how this board is going to take my ideas, i've decided it's best not to delve to deep, there. (and, btw, i haven't seen any past religion-related threads here.. well, maybe one, but i don't believe i participated.)
Aran is offline

09-07-2001, 05:22 PM	#10
Pendragon Meow Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Swindon, UK Posts: 724	In my opinion religion is a disease that clouds judgement and forces invisible barriers between people. More wars have been fought over religion than over anything. Nearly all religions have their morals but they all go to scabe when another religion disagrees with them. They think they're doing the best thing by their standards whilst totally throwing their morals out of the mswindow. But that's just me... __________________
Pendragon is offline

09-07-2001, 05:27 PM	#11
Aran Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 1,301	wow, that's exactly what i was going to write if someone responded futher on the original track of this discussion. heh, religion is a blinder, pure and simple.
Aran is offline

09-07-2001, 05:31 PM	#12
Pendragon Meow Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Swindon, UK Posts: 724	Great minds think alike.... Hopefully noone will be offended by my spontaneous outburst. They usually are... __________________
Pendragon is offline

09-07-2001, 05:39 PM	#13
Pendragon Meow Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Swindon, UK Posts: 724	It's a shame really... __________________
Pendragon is offline

09-07-2001, 06:04 PM	#14
Generator Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 238	I think religion was created as a way to control lower class society back in the day. The upper class were scared there were more poor people than them and said "hey what if we made them believe in this, they wont come kill us eat our stuff and take our money." and thus began religion. A way to control society by playing with their beliefs. Of course I could be wrong...
Generator is offline

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