.NET woes

This is a discussion on .NET woes within the A Brief History of Cprogramming.com forums, part of the Community Boards category; Am I to understand now that MS is forcing us to use .NET to do mail, internet, messaging, etc, etc? ...

  1. #1
    Super Moderator VirtualAce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Posts
    9,596

    .NET woes

    Am I to understand now that MS is forcing us to use .NET to do mail, internet, messaging, etc, etc?

    I look up MAPI, Internet sessions, database support, etc, etc, and it all leads to .NET.

    It seems as though the entire Platform SDK besides .NET has been deprecated.
    This is not a good thing IMO.

    In order to use .NET I must use CLR which I'm trying to avoid.


    EDIT: Ok I gave in to the big boys. Have a book coming in the mail all about .NET and CLI. Somehow I'm not quite as excited about this one as my other books. But, if I want my skills to be 'marketable', I have to stay up to date and unfortunately that means C++/CLI and .NET.
    Last edited by VirtualAce; 07-16-2006 at 06:10 PM.

  2. #2
    The Right Honourable psychopath's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Where circles begin.
    Posts
    1,070
    Welcome to the dark side of C++ Bubba.

    Although the change shouldn't be too hard on you; I mean, you already use Direct X.
    Memorial University of Newfoundland
    Computer Science

    Mac and OpenGL evangelist.

  3. #3
    pwns nooblars
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Portland, Or
    Posts
    1,094
    .../cry...


    (So that this post isn't completely meaningless... I don't understand why people took to .NET so fast, half the people in my programming classes love it, and I can't see why.)

  4. #4
    Registered User mrafcho001's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    483
    I've had some experience with .NET. It's extremely easy to use compared to C++ and the Win32 APIs. And it has the Visual editor so designing the look of your applications is easier.

    However, i still prefer C++ over .NET
    My Website
    010000110010101100101011
    Add Color To Your Code!

  5. #5
    Supermassive black hole cboard_member's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    1,709
    You'd have to physically force me to use .NET. I'm talking bamboo shoots under my fingernails while waving a red hot poker towards my eye.
    Good class architecture is not like a Swiss Army Knife; it should be more like a well balanced throwing knife.

    - Mike McShaffry

  6. #6
    Registered /usr
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Newport, South Wales, UK
    Posts
    1,262
    Winge all you want, MS is naturally going to place .NET at the core of their SDK and hence SDK docs. I envisage a point in time where all C/C++/other non-.NET compiled code is ran through a virtual machine/legacy layer of the CLR.

    If you don't like it, move to Linux. It's the choice of a new generation.

  7. #7
    train spotter
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    near a computer
    Posts
    3,856
    Least after .NET I was able to stop continuosly explaining GDI leaks caused by SelectObject() (or by coders who dont RTFM).


    EDIT:
    It's the choice of a new generation.
    You forget the Golden Rule...he who has the gold makes the rules.

    We the older generation still use windows and pay / get paid to write code for it.
    Last edited by novacain; 07-17-2006 at 03:08 AM.
    "Man alone suffers so excruciatingly in the world that he was compelled to invent laughter."
    Friedrich Nietzsche

    "I spent a lot of my money on booze, birds and fast cars......the rest I squandered."
    George Best

    "If you are going through hell....keep going."
    Winston Churchill

  8. #8
    (?<!re)tired Mario F.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    7,440
    Good thing i don't want to... become "marketable".

    What I will not take is an operating system that asks me a small fortune just for the "privilege" of coding on their system.

    With every passing day, Linux becomes more and more a sexy operating system.
    The programmer’s wife tells him: “Run to the store and pick up a loaf of bread. If they have eggs, get a dozen.”
    The programmer comes home with 12 loaves of bread.


    Originally Posted by brewbuck:
    Reimplementing a large system in another language to get a 25% performance boost is nonsense. It would be cheaper to just get a computer which is 25% faster.

  9. #9
    Super Moderator VirtualAce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Posts
    9,596
    However the job boards are not asking for Linux.

    The most popular stuff on job boards for C/C++ is:

    .NET
    CLI
    SQL
    MFC
    COM
    COM+
    ODBC

    and others.

    It only makes sense to learn these technologies rather than try to fight what is obviously a losing battle.

    For games and such and hobby code I'll use DirectX and my own wrappers, technologies, etc. But for the workplace, I'm gonna have to bite the bullet and learn what's needed, instead of what I like.

    And I guess one way to defend C/C++ as a viable future language is to prove it can be used in cooperation with current and future technolgies. The problem here is that most of the jobs do not require C/C++ and I think it's because people are intimidated by it and that the dev time is significantly longer. I love the language and think it's the best thing since sliced bread, but not everyone in the world shares my opinion.

    So I'm not turning my back on C/C++, I'm just expanding my horizons. Here are the facts. I can attempt to defend pure C/C++ and never get a job because my skill set is only C/C++ or I can expand my horizons, branch out, and learn current and/or new technolgies and perhaps land a job.

    Need necessitates knowledge. And I need to get a computer job and stop spinning my wheels at 'good' non-computer jobs or I'm never gonna make the transition. I must expand my skill set. I may even attempt some Java, but know that C/C++ is and always will be my fav, even if I can't use it in the workplace.
    Last edited by VirtualAce; 07-17-2006 at 03:44 AM.

  10. #10
    (?<!re)tired Mario F.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    7,440
    You are right.

    However, these particular boards don't seem to have Linux as a popular alternative. EDIT: Ignore this line... I thought you were referring to these boards.

    I'm not a good example to follow anyways. I'm finally leaving my career to open a small bookstore. I finally have the time to learn C++ as I always wanted instead of having my past experience and job requirements constantly pushing me towards Visual Basic. I do get the chance to make choices. My days of slavery are almost over.
    The programmer’s wife tells him: “Run to the store and pick up a loaf of bread. If they have eggs, get a dozen.”
    The programmer comes home with 12 loaves of bread.


    Originally Posted by brewbuck:
    Reimplementing a large system in another language to get a 25% performance boost is nonsense. It would be cheaper to just get a computer which is 25% faster.

  11. #11
    Registered /usr
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Newport, South Wales, UK
    Posts
    1,262
    Quote Originally Posted by novacain
    You forget the Golden Rule...he who has the gold makes the rules.
    I was actually quoting Pepsi. How popular is that vs other drinks?

    Bubba you already use COM if you DirectX, so you can tick that on your list. I can too, both with DirectX and other things like MS Word via Automation ("Look ma! No headers!"). ODBC as a skill doesn't mean much, just knowing the connection strings and DSNs really.

    But .NET is the most requested skill at the mo due to MS's aggressive marketing to business, to the point where they all believe it'll solve all their systems issues at a cost to smile about. If you're looking to break into the programming industry you have to go with what's in vogue.

  12. #12
    Anti-Poster
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    1,399
    Quote Originally Posted by Mario F
    What I will not take is an operating system that asks me a small fortune just for the "privilege" of coding on their system.
    Quote Originally Posted by SMurf
    ...they all believe it'll solve all their systems issues at a cost to smile about.
    I'm sorry...I'm missing the whole "cost" part of it. The compiler is free, and the runtime is free. If you want to pay for a flashy IDE, that's a choice. What exactly is this mythical "cost" you speak of? Personally, I use .Net for hobby programming, and I haven't had to spend a penny.

    [edit] Holy crap, the new edit box is awesome.
    If I did your homework for you, then you might pass your class without learning how to write a program like this. Then you might graduate and get your degree without learning how to write a program like this. You might become a professional programmer without knowing how to write a program like this. Someday you might work on a project with me without knowing how to write a program like this. Then I would have to do you serious bodily harm. - Jack Klein

  13. #13
    Code Goddess Prelude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    9,796
    >I'm sorry...I'm missing the whole "cost" part of it.
    The documentation is free too. Presumably they're talking about the exorbitant cost of the OS itself. Though in a PC market where you essentially have Linux, which is free, and Windows, which is not, it's hard for the cost of Windows to not be exorbitant when compared to free.
    My best code is written with the delete key.

  14. #14
    Registered /usr
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Newport, South Wales, UK
    Posts
    1,262
    Quote Originally Posted by pianorain
    I'm sorry...I'm missing the whole "cost" part of it. The compiler is free, and the runtime is free. If you want to pay for a flashy IDE, that's a choice. What exactly is this mythical "cost" you speak of? Personally, I use .Net for hobby programming, and I haven't had to spend a penny.
    It's just a shame that people can't live on "free", which is why there is a cost to the businesses I was referring to. They have to pay people to get them to do stuff. It sucks, I know.

    With "better" or faster development systems comes reduced cost as these Star Trek/Wars-worshipping, funny-smelling weirdos do things for your business and are promptly shown the door as soon as the project is done. Also there is a reduced need to phone them up should things go wrong as the system is "better" like that (or so MS has told them...).

  15. #15
    (?<!re)tired Mario F.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    7,440
    You don't need to pay for a flashy IDE either... Visual Studio Express Edition will do.

    However the cost I was talking about is indeed tied to the fact it only works under Windows. You will not see many libraries for C++/CLI free of charge, you will not see many IDE contenders for C++/CLI free of charge. You will not see many tools (profilers, code generators, documentation systems,...) for C++/CLI free of charge...

    I hope I'm wrong. And Microsoft will provide C++/CLI and the CLR with a true non-commercial purpose (Ahah... sorry).

    Oh... and say goodbye to portability.

    Regardless, as I said before on another thread, I couldn't care any less what Microsoft does with the .Net Framework. It's the possibility that they may push C++/CLI as the replacement for ISO C++ programming that scares me.

    As for Bubba, believing that the only option to be marketable in the job industry is to learn C++/CLI, seems to me rather naive.
    The programmer’s wife tells him: “Run to the store and pick up a loaf of bread. If they have eggs, get a dozen.”
    The programmer comes home with 12 loaves of bread.


    Originally Posted by brewbuck:
    Reimplementing a large system in another language to get a 25% performance boost is nonsense. It would be cheaper to just get a computer which is 25% faster.

Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Popular pages Recent additions subscribe to a feed

Similar Threads

  1. migrate from .Net 2.0 to .Net 3.0
    By George2 in forum C# Programming
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 07-25-2007, 04:07 AM
  2. Serial port woes (visual C++ .NET 2003)
    By RancidWannaRiot in forum Windows Programming
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 11-21-2005, 07:59 AM
  3. Some .NET Distribution Stats
    By nickname_changed in forum C# Programming
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05-14-2005, 03:41 AM
  4. .net
    By ygfperson in forum A Brief History of Cprogramming.com
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 02-15-2002, 12:15 AM
  5. Visual J#
    By mfc2themax in forum A Brief History of Cprogramming.com
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-08-2001, 02:41 PM

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21