Japanese

This is a discussion on Japanese within the A Brief History of Cprogramming.com forums, part of the Community Boards category; No! Japanese isn't made like that! Japanese people used to have the same language as the Chinese. They use the ...

  1. #16
    Back! ^.^ *Michelle*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    568
    No! Japanese isn't made like that!

    Japanese people used to have the same language as the Chinese. They use the same words, but they pronounce them differently, just like Mandarin and Cantonese, they are the same written but differently spoken...

    But the Japanese are an arrogant bunch and decides to make up their own written language... Therefore, they made up the phonetic characters. And used those to written ever since. Those characters represent a sound each and when combined together it forms the "sound" according to the way they used to pronounce Chinese words... And then, so that's it's easy for foreign people or themselves too, they translated those phonetic characters into Latin alphabet according to their sounds. And there comes Romanji (I think)... Now, they think that using some "Chinese Characters" with Phonetic characters in their writing is considered "high-class" , and in fact, the more Chinese characters the better... (arent' they stupid)... So, that's what I know about the Japanese language... AND THE CHINESE CAME FIRST!!! Oh well...

    And btw, you can learn Chinese phonetically too. There is Ping Ying (Mandarin Alphabet translations) and I think there is a Cantonese Ping Ying too, but it's called something else. Acutally the whole name for Mandarin Alphabet translations is "Han Yu Ping Ying", "Han" meaning a famous dynasty we had long ago. But now, Han is used to represent Chinese. "Yu" Language, "Ping Ying" means phonetics. And I think you are wrong about Chinese being easier to read. Because the Ping Ying we use is not pronounced the same as the English alphabet. "You" would be pronounced differently in Ping Ying. But on the other hand, Japanese phonetics can be pronounced exactly as English and is much easier. There are sounds in the Chinese language that doesn't even exist in English.

    And it depends on what "Chinese" you mean, like there is Mandarin, Cantonese, Puk Gin (Not sure if I translated that right) and lots others. I know Cantonese and Mandarin. They are not easy to learn.

    I think both is basically the same hard, but Japanese may be easier.
    Michelle (o^.^o)
    *Unique*
    Kaomoji House

  2. #17
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    412
    Well, Chinese and Japanese had their roots in the same language, but they are as different as can be (they are only similar when written, and then because they borrowed the written language). They are similar in the way that English and Latin are similar -- English borrows many latin words, and most of their alphabet, but the languages are very distinct.

    The major difference in the written languages is that the chinese characters do not always mean the same. In Japanese, they can also be used as stems for japanese words -- so the word "mizukara" (to do for oneself) could be written beginning with the chinese character for "water" (water in japanese is "mizu"). Here, the meaning has nothing to do with water, and everything to do with how the character is pronounced.

    In Japanese, the characters are also sometimes pronounced the same as Chinese, and again form the roots of words.

    For a discussion on the development of written Japanese:

    http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~dee/ANCJAPAN/WRITING.HTM

    And for a discussion of the origin of their spoken language:

    http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~dee/ANCJAPAN/LANGUAGE.HTM

  3. #18
    Registered User Camilo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    78
    my old japanese teacher (he is from Japan) said that chinese and japanese are extremely different and that japanese is nicer than chinese (ok, he hated China), and one of the only remainds that I have from that course is that japanese is extremely different from chinese, except that for us, both seem to be funny lines, I can be wrong, of course.


    Camilo
    no, life is nice, just a girl fooling around, alcohol fixes everything.
    OH, I now have a High School Diploma and need of ron (drink)

  4. #19
    Back! ^.^ *Michelle*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    568
    Well, it would make more sense if it's the other way around...
    What does China have that is hateful? Well, may be the government? But obviously, that has nothing to do with him...

    However, it would make sense if Chinese people hate Japanese, 'cause the Japanese had invaded China before and killed like thousands of people everyday... And because the stupid Japanese came right when there was a civil war going on, Taiwan (formerly China) was forced to join up forces with the communist party to fight the Japanese... Well, Taiwan was on the brink of defeating the rebellious Communist party, but was forced to stop and fight the stupid Jap. instead... SO, the communist party eventually had the military power to defeat Taiwan after the Jap. were defeated. and the damn communists took over China... We never did anything to the Jap.... Why the heck should the Jap. hate us? The only reason I can think of is because they think they are somehow"superior" and should have the right to China, something like the "manifest destiny" of America... Geez... And Japanes is VERY similar to Chinese, he must admit it, or else he would be an ignorant fool... (sorry, I'm getting a little emotional here... ^.^) I have never learned Japanese, but I am fluent in Chinese. I can read 50% of the written Jap. as I said earlier.. If it is not similar how can I know that? They actually use the same set of Characters as Chinese and the meanings are basically identical... what the heck... your teacher is weird... (but a typical Japanese, most of them are like that)...
    Michelle (o^.^o)
    *Unique*
    Kaomoji House

  5. #20
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    412
    Ahh, the whole japanese vs. chinese debate... nice to know a centuries-old hatred still exists.

    Japan and China have been, historically, like England and France; bitter enemies, although in both cases, both were originally one people.

    Honestly, if you look on ANY ethnic group, they've committed crimes. There's not one group, ever, that can claim moral superiority. As long as Japanese and Chinese hate each other, neither side will ever lack for reason to hate the other.

    The most recent major Chinese crimes against the Japanese, and the Japanese against the Chinese, are over 5 decades old. The VAST majority of the Japanese have never directly suffered because of China. The VAST majority of the Chinese have never directly suffered because of Japan.

  6. #21
    Back! ^.^ *Michelle*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    568
    >The VAST majority of the Chinese have never directly suffered because of Japan.<

    Oh ya right. Japanese INVADED China so there is obviously harm done to the VAST majority of the people. War ALWAYS hurt people. And if it wasn't for the Japanese, the communist party would have been defeated and Taiwan will be in charge of ALL of China, not just a little island. And you should knwo how terrible teh communist party governs. And look at Taiwan. If Taiwan had ruled China instead of the communist party, China would be as properous and advanced as Taiwan. At least, there would be not STUPID simplified Chinese for me to learn.. Simplified Chinese is totally ruining the Chinese literature. Simplified Chinese combines different words into one word with mulitple meanings.. You knwo how annoying that can get. And the traditional Chinese originates from long ago and has easy to remember origins which helps in the meaning of the word. Now only Hong Kong and Taiwan (main places) are using traditional Chinese, even Canada uses Simplified chinese, damn. and soon Hong Kong is going to be assimilated too and forced to use simplified chinese because the stupid china took over HK... I can keep on going to name all the harm japanese have done to the VAST majority of Chinese people... but I don't want to bore you, though I have done so already, probably...
    Michelle (o^.^o)
    *Unique*
    Kaomoji House

  7. #22
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    412
    As long as people are unwilling to forget violence of the past, we'll never move on. Most of the Japanese people who invaded China are dead; they'd be 70-90 years old if they're alive. You can try to blame their children and grandchildren for crimes committed before they were born, but what good does that do? Certainly people can't change the actions of their ancestors, and I don't believe people need to apologize for actions someone else committed.

    We can ALL play the "your ancestors did xxx to my ancestors" game, but it's counterproductive. Take it as a positive that the people who committed crimes are dead or will die soon, and that 99.9% or more of the current Japanese population not only did nothing to cause the crimes, but couldn't have stopped them if they tried to.

  8. #23
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    85
    Is it easier to learn the Chinese, than the Japanese?
    i think it is easier for someone that speaks english to learn to speak japanese. Americans seem to have a lot of trouble pronoucing chinese, or at least mandarin. i was watching the amazing race the other day, when that guy was trying to tell the taxi driver to go to south gate and it took like 10 minutes for the taxi driver to understand. that was so funny.

    and michelle, i agree with you about the simplified chinese characters.

  9. #24
    Back! ^.^ *Michelle*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    568
    Ya, I think Japanese is easier for English-speaking people too...

    Um, qwertiop, I assume that you are Chinese? right?

    And it is not a "your ancestors did xxx to my ancestors" game that I was arguing about. You said that Chinese never suffered from what the japanese did, well I just want to say you are wrong. Anyway, I am not saying that Jap. nowadays should be held responisble for the actions of their ancestors, but I think that Jap. people are still pretty arrogant. This is not a biased opinion, it is true. I don't know where I can get proof for that so don't challenge me. I just know it from their actions... I don't remember what action made me think that, so....don't ask...
    Michelle (o^.^o)
    *Unique*
    Kaomoji House

  10. #25
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    412
    Odd, because of the 40 or so Japanese people I know, see, and talk to, I've gotten the impression they're the most polite people on earth; not once have they come off as arrogant, even when they legitimately do something praiseworthy, they are quite humble about it. If anything, they take too LITTLE credit for their accomplishments.

    My point was very few of the *current* residents of China have suffered because of the *current* residents of Japan, yet they hate them regardless.

  11. #26
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    412
    Originally posted by qwertiop


    i think it is easier for someone that speaks english to learn to speak japanese. Americans seem to have a lot of trouble pronoucing chinese, or at least mandarin. i was watching the amazing race the other day, when that guy was trying to tell the taxi driver to go to south gate and it took like 10 minutes for the taxi driver to understand. that was so funny.

    and michelle, i agree with you about the simplified chinese characters.
    It's pretty hard for ANYONE to pronounce a significantly different language. I've heard some reasonably good Korean, Chinese, and Japanese speakers, but never would I have assumed English was their first language. The Spanish accent isn't very noticable, the Russian accent is heavy and hard to lose. I did know one Indonesian who spoke nearly flawless english after about 5 years of studying it; she was probably the best non-native speaker I've heard so far.

  12. #27
    Linguistic Engineer... doubleanti's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    2,459
    hate begats hate... that's a good point... fill the hole with love...

    and, not to lessen the effect of your observation of the 40 or so... but keep in mind that the majority of japanese live in japan... also, consider this... 1.2 billion chinese + 1 billion indian make ~1/3 earth asian... in that light, you couldn't necessarily make the same assumption about chinese either... [the one's i know are great... at work too... i work in a chinese fast food restaurant...]
    hasafraggin shizigishin oppashigger...

  13. #28
    Back! ^.^ *Michelle*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    568
    Well, don't you think, then, that it's amazing Japanese should hate CHINESE? It doesn't make much sense the other way around. but Japanese hating chinese? wut the heck...
    Michelle (o^.^o)
    *Unique*
    Kaomoji House

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Popular pages Recent additions subscribe to a feed

Similar Threads

  1. Turbo C with japanese version
    By thaw in forum C Programming
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 11-27-2008, 02:25 AM
  2. So you want to learn Japanese...
    By Perspective in forum A Brief History of Cprogramming.com
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 07-07-2003, 10:23 PM
  3. Chemtrails?
    By frenchfry164 in forum A Brief History of Cprogramming.com
    Replies: 70
    Last Post: 06-16-2003, 12:07 AM
  4. Office 2000 japanese text
    By Necrodeemer in forum Tech Board
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 01-09-2003, 02:46 PM
  5. Japanese Cartoons VS. American Cartoons
    By Yoshi in forum A Brief History of Cprogramming.com
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: 12-21-2001, 12:53 AM

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21