genocide law

This is a discussion on genocide law within the A Brief History of Cprogramming.com forums, part of the Community Boards category; There's far, far more than money involved in this. You're talking about arresting a United States Army four star general. ...

  1. #16
    Registered User rick barclay's Avatar
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    There's far, far more than money involved in this. You're talking
    about arresting a United States Army four star general. Under this war crimes legislation, charges already have been filed against Ariel Sharon, Franks, and Sec. of State Colin Powell.
    It seems to me that if the Belgic government ever went so far
    as to arrest one of our highest ranking diplomats or the
    commander-if-chief of the U. S. Armed Forces Central Command,
    those acts might just be considered as acts of war against the
    United States. The fact that the U.S. is threatening to withold
    its share of funding for the new NATO headquarters in Belgium unless the war crimes law is repealed is simply Washington's
    way of asking politely, "Please don't do this." From what I understand about all this, Belgium has given some assurance that if anyone is indicted, then the country in which that person resides will be so informed of the indictment well before anyone has a chance to be arrested. Needless to say, Rumsfeld was not
    swayed by these assurances. Small wonder.
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  2. #17
    and the Hat of Clumsiness GanglyLamb's Avatar
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    From what I understand about all this, Belgium has given some assurance that if anyone is indicted, then the country in which that person resides will be so informed of the indictment well before anyone has a chance to be arrested. Needless to say, Rumsfeld was not
    swayed by these assurances. Small wonder.
    True therefor you dont see this law in action... maybe sometimes. But who is going to be so stupid to visit a country where he'll be arrested as soon as he enters the country.

  3. #18
    Just because ygfperson's Avatar
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    It's a genocide law, not a war crimes law. Nobody in the United States has committed genocide, at least not in this century. Why should we be concerned about this law? Anyone who wanted to prosecute Tommy Franks would have to provide evidence of genocide, which doesn't exist.

  4. #19
    and the Hat of Clumsiness GanglyLamb's Avatar
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    Anyone who wanted to prosecute Tommy Franks would have to provide evidence of genocide, which doesn't exist.
    What a coincidence, i just listened to the radio and i heard the news. It appaers Belgium already has some lawsuits running against highly ranked politicians of the US.

  5. #20
    Just because ygfperson's Avatar
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    Really? How nice. But it doesn't mean they're guilty.

  6. #21
    Registered User rick barclay's Avatar
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    Originally posted by GanglyLamb
    True therefor you dont see this law in action... maybe sometimes. But who is going to be so stupid to visit a country where he'll be arrested as soon as he enters the country.
    Right! So if NATO HQ's is in Belgium, just what are alll those
    American brass hats who're under indictment for genocide supposed to do when it's time to go to the meeting?

    ygfperson, you are absolutely, without a doubt, the last person on earth I would ever consider employing as my lawyer.
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  7. #22
    Just because ygfperson's Avatar
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    If they're under indictment for genocide, we've got to extridite them, anyway. What difference does it make where it takes place?

    And a law in Belgium which can convict American generals is on shaky legal ground. That's why we do international war crimes trials.

  8. #23
    and the Hat of Clumsiness GanglyLamb's Avatar
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    Right! So if NATO HQ's is in Belgium, just what are alll those
    American brass hats who're under indictment for genocide supposed to do when it's time to go to the meeting?
    Righto, but as i said before some Belgian politician said that we will make sure that American representatives cant be prosecuted.
    /*But what does he ,*/ #define American_representative /* as ?*/

    I think that if you commit genocide then you should be trialed in some way, even if you were the president of the who knows what or king from whatever country, and that it does not matter then anylonger wether you are black,white or who-knows-what-color.

    I guess its like in Animal Farm from Orwell.
    ::quote::
    All animals are equal to each other.
    ( later in the story they change this to )
    All animals are equal to each other, but some are more equal then others.
    ::::::::::
    Even Orwell already knew that and he lived in ...., when ?!?.

  9. #24
    the hat of redundancy hat nvoigt's Avatar
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    As the US has arrested a russian hacker upon entering the US for cracking when it wasn't even illegal in the country he did it in, the US has the least right to demand immunity. Belgium is doing the same thing the US did years ago. And the US is putting in their full weight to ensure that Americans do not get charged. Just Americans, mind you. They are not saying it's unjust for all. It's just not acceptable for Americans.
    After all, protecting their own is a very natural behaviour, but the US manages to do this in a way that looks very unfavourable and pretty egoistic. I agree that the US has to protect it's own citizens first and foremost. To any government, the own citizens should be a top priority, any other things should come second. However, the US constantly manage to show this egoistic behaviour in such a way that you cannot find it not offensive. Treading a bit more slowly and more quiet would probably lead to the same results with less ruffled feathers.
    hth
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  10. #25
    Registered User rick barclay's Avatar
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    You're mixing apples with oranges, nvoight. Specifically, you're
    combining politico-military matters with civilian doings in the
    case of that Russian . civillian hacker.


    And GL, you're telling me, an American four-star general, that I
    have nothing to fear because your Belgium politician SAID
    he's going to make it so I can't be prosecuted for alleged
    genocide!!?? That's so very reassussing...

















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  11. #26
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    Righto, but as i said before some Belgian politician said that we will make sure that American representatives cant be prosecuted.
    That's a bit strange. Why should American representatives not be prosecuted?

    I think that if you commit genocide then you should be trialed in some way, even if you were the president of the who knows what or king from whatever country, and that it does not matter then anylonger wether you are black,white or who-knows-what-color.
    And that's how it should be.

  12. #27
    and the Hat of Clumsiness GanglyLamb's Avatar
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    From what ive heard about lots of you is that if you do anything wrong you should be trialed, but then theres the army.
    I was only following orders from ...who and "who" was following orders from.... who and so on.

    @rick_barclay:
    I would react the same way you are if i were you.
    Indeed he SAID it, that doesnt mean that it isnt going to be written down somewhere.
    I think that Belgium and the US will come to some kind of human agreement. I cant imagine that a US citizen doesnt want to have someone prosecuted when they commited genocide.
    We are all human beings so i would be stunned when i saw that in the agreement between the US and Belgium there would be something like a full protection for US representatives no matter what they did.


    In the end im lucky im not a politician so i musnt worry about these things, but im worried as a civialian of the world.
    Where's justice if we can prosecute one and not the other for doing the same crime.

    Anyway this genocide law is getting lots of support, it would be pittyfull to see it weakened or something because some people feel this law as a tread ( even before they actually commited some crime, or that the crime has been proved ).

  13. #28
    the hat of redundancy hat nvoigt's Avatar
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    Specifically, you're combining politico-military matters with civilian doings in the case of that Russian
    I don't think that matters. There is a law in the country A that allows prosecution of a crime that is not prosecuted in country B. Citizens of B are arrested upon entering A and prosecuted for something that might not even be a crime at the location they commited it.

    Set A = Belgium, B = USA: Unfair (according to the US)
    Set A = US, B = Russia: Not unfair (according to the US)

    I don't mind America protecting it's citizens. I just think they are lacking diplomacy, because the way they do it looks ridiculous and egoistic at best.
    hth
    -nv

    She was so Blonde, she spent 20 minutes looking at the orange juice can because it said "Concentrate."

    When in doubt, read the FAQ.
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  14. #29
    mustang benny bennyandthejets's Avatar
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    On the subject of soldiers obeying orders, what about all the Taliban soldiers being held in Guantanamo Bay, denied any human rights at all? They were just soldiers. Taliban soldiers are not Al-Qaeda operatives, spies or agents or whatever. I'm am especially annoyed about the David Hicks issue. For those of you who don't know, David Hicks is a young Australian (which I am also) who became a moslem and went to Afghanistan to fight for the Taliban. Now America accuses him of being a terrorist for Al-Qaeda and may even execute him, to set an example to others around the world.

    This is a disguisting state of affairs. I seem to remember something about a Geneva convention, about, what was it, prisoners of war? Of course, George Bush conveniently forgets those important rules that manage to incorporate human rights into a wartime situation, when it's not American soldiers who are involved.
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  15. #30
    It's full of stars adrianxw's Avatar
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    The US gets around the Geneva Convention by calling the prisoners "Illegal Combatants" rather than soldiers and hence prisoners of war. By changing the name, they believe they do not need to consider the treaty.

    Of course this is bogus.
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