Microsoft Quit the OpenGL ARB...

This is a discussion on Microsoft Quit the OpenGL ARB... within the A Brief History of Cprogramming.com forums, part of the Community Boards category; Read all about it... http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/29555.html this could be something good... this could be somthing bad... if its bad prepare for ...

  1. #1
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    Microsoft Quit the OpenGL ARB...

    Read all about it...

    http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/29555.html

    this could be something good... this could be somthing bad...

    if its bad prepare for another antitrust suit, plus the possibility of the ARB suing their ass of depending on what it is...

    if its good then horray for MS...

    I for one must remain indifferent on the subject though ever suspicios(since i doubt "longhorn" wil support GL at all, also it is my suspision that that is what prompted the move), despite my dispise for MS, since until the last meeting they have been willing contributers to the OpenGL ARB, and have done little to hinder it within the ARB itself that is, though outside as you know is a different story altogether...

    enough with my banter...
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    I don't like the idea of microsoft just going all out on Direct3D in longhorn. Direct3D and OpenGL are almost the same in popularity. Hmm...

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    though its obvious most of the people here care little about anything that is not currently biting them on the ass...

    heres another report on it WITH quotes from MS on the subject...

    read read read...

    http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1104-991280.html

    I've also heard a RUMOR(ie. probable BS) that MS is gonna try pulling its patents and charge end users for using OpenGL, Personally i think this is bull$$$$ since if im not mistaken the ARB by-law's make this illegal and even though they quit they still are bound by them up untill that point, secondly if they do that they are shooting themselves inthe head, and they seriously underestimate the widespread use, need, and want for OpenGL, it would most likely be the final nail in their coffin, or close to it.
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    secondly if they do that they are shooting themselves inthe head, and they seriously underestimate the widespread use, need, and want for OpenGL, it would most likely be the final nail in their coffin, or close to it.
    amen

    EDIT:

    ?

    in a separate statement, Microsoft said it would continue to support the technology despite its resignation from the board.
    Last edited by Silvercord; 03-07-2003 at 03:57 PM.

  5. #5
    Registered User SAMSAM's Avatar
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    "There is no force greater ,
    than an idea which its time has arrived"

    If MS want to fight a better or equal technology(opengl),
    they are doomed from the start.

    you should have suspected their intentions from the slow
    process ,it takes them to even, update windows to the new
    opengl version1.2.

  6. #6
    Xei
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    I think it's only a matter of time before they stop use of OpenGL, which is perfectly legal for them to discontinue support.... unless if they have a contract to support the technology. However, it's definately causing me to think of changing from OpenGL to DirectX.

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    I don't think they'll discontinue support of OpenGL. Windows will lose support of lots of companies, including Id Software. Although, it wouldn't suprise me if they did, the way MS is.

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    do you think this could turn into a lawsuit from video card manufacturers? Kind of like Sun vs Microsoft (microsoft would not include the latest version of the java virtual machine in internet explorer or something). I mean isn't it true some video cards just plain run better with OpenGL? If anyone starts losing business because microsoft stops supporting OpenGL, there's going to be an antitrust case and gates' small company is going to get...well...smaller.

    you should have suspected their intentions from the slow
    process ,it takes them to even, update windows to the new
    opengl version1.2.
    well actually you probably already have OpenGL 1.2 or higher if you've kept consistent with updating your drivers. They're included with the drivers for your video card. That's why it seems to take so long to update OpenGL

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    >
    I think it's only a matter of time before they stop use of OpenGL, which is perfectly legal for them to discontinue support.... unless if they have a contract to support the technology.
    <

    they did till they left the ARB, but the never followed it then anyway.

    >However, it's definately causing me to think of changing from OpenGL to DirectX.

    wha(t)? why? do you not realize the ramifications to MS here? im not jokin when i say they've shot themselves in the head,
    but since longhorn already is incompatible with everything...
    no body and i mean nobody's gonna put up with the OTHER RUMOR they are going to write a Direct-X wrapper for OpenGL, which is guaranteed to fail... but its just like them.

    >I don't think they'll discontinue support of OpenGL.

    look at the RUMOR above.

    >Windows will lose support of lots of companies, including Id Software.

    they only pull so much weight. though im extremely impressed with carmak of late.

    >
    do you think this could turn into a lawsuit from video card manufacturers? Kind of like Sun vs Microsoft (microsoft would not include the latest version of the java virtual machine in internet explorer or something). I mean isn't it true some video cards just plain run better with OpenGL? If anyone starts losing business because microsoft stops supporting OpenGL, there's going to be an antitrust case and gates' small company is going to get...well...smaller.
    <

    probably. and if they claim IP on any of the OpenGL IP they bough from SGI they so freakin dead, cause even now if im not mistaken thats illegal and the deal would be nullified.

    >
    well actually you probably already have OpenGL 1.2 or higher if you've kept consistent with updating your drivers. They're included with the drivers for your video card.
    <

    drivers are not the issue. most drivers support 1.4 and some support 2.0, we are taking about the SW implementation which is vital, do you like dealing with everthing standard like its an extension? i sure as hell don't, hence thats probably why they dont update.

    >That's why it seems to take so long to update OpenGL

    they don't and havent in many many many many long years.
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  10. #10
    the hat of redundancy hat nvoigt's Avatar
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    Windows will lose support of lots of companies, including Id Software.
    And ID will do what ? Sell their products to a minority of free or open source software Linux gurus who always had the dream to one day pay for software ? Fat chance. They will swallow it and continue to make money from windows games.
    hth
    -nv

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    Then ask a smart question.

  11. #11
    &TH of undefined behavior Fordy's Avatar
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    Originally posted by nvoigt
    And ID will do what ? Sell their products to a minority of free or open source software Linux gurus who always had the dream to one day pay for software ? Fat chance. They will swallow it and continue to make money from windows games.
    Brutally put....but very true.....

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    Wasn't Quake 3 dual format (Windows/Mac)? In that case, it's make money from Windows and Mac games

  13. #13
    RoD
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    As much as i perfer OpenGL, its imo that this will eventually be a huge ripple in OpenGL's development. Being that the majority of the world runs Windows, i think many of the video card makers, game makers, and programmers otherwise will conform to Direct3D in the interest of their buisness and its successful operation, which sadly, is largely dependent on Microsofts operating system.

    I kinda think this may be a good thing for linux though. Those developers who are hard-core opengl will simply work their asses off to produce newer and better OpenGL versions for the linux operating system. This offers a few, although over time, benifits for us that use linux. For starters all the people who perfer OpenGL will begin to (also) use linux for their games, increasing linux popularity. Increased popularity means increased productivity and development.

    Microsoft carries with it a large following, and alot of companies in the computer industry wont survive if they dont adapt with microsoft. Call it wrong of Gates, call it dumb of Gates, call it what you want, but through clenched teeth i call it smart.

    I am a large fan of OpenGL, and perfer it over DirectX for alot of reasons, but my largest worry is not what Microsoft has done, but what other members of the ARB might follow out of fear for their buisness....

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    I agree in part with what you say, but you appearantly(sp?) are not up to date on where things are headed... OpenGL is the future... period, there is little MS can do is gonna change that.

    Wether MS supports it or not unless they take measures to prevent it, does not stop you from using OpenGL on a windows platform, somebody else is gonna write the SW implementation... and the drivers will probably still support it, though we may just be forced to use the OpenML, SW OpenGL imp, but since its STD opengl 2.0, it doesn't really matter where it comes from.

    With or without MS, OpenGL has a huge future, especially on embedded systems, Direct-X can't compete there.

    >what other members of the ARB might follow out of fear for their buisness....

    the only one i see who might is nVidia because of their very close relationship with MS, and thats still a longshot.

    Not many companies are gonna drop OpenGL just because MS wants to expand their empire some more, and force the use of a proprietary API, how are they gonna convince high end 3D people to drop GL?

    I'm betting you'll see a lot more support than you might imagine.

    Be ready for longhorn to tank, MS will make back their money as per usual, but i don't believe if they drop OpenGL plus the fact that it is 100% incompatible with anything in existance that it will get the large sales of previous os's.

    then again, i fail continually to comprehend how little the end users typically care about anything but does their chat work...

    >
    Microsoft carries with it a large following, and alot of companies in the computer industry wont survive if they dont adapt with microsoft.
    <

    and i'd expect them to follow suit... they have no choise this is what MS banks on.

    >Call it wrong of Gates, call it dumb of Gates, call it what you want, but through clenched teeth i call it smart.


    and i'd have to agree, MS is a pretty good examle of a what a capatilistic buisness should look like, but never the less very evil.

    thats why we have Trust laws...
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  15. #15
    RoD
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    As i keep hearing about Longhorn, i keep working more and more on Mandrake hehe.

    I also agree that opengl has a huge future ahead, but i think it will be more nix specific then most people realise.

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