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This is a discussion on God within the A Brief History of Cprogramming.com forums, part of the Community Boards category; Again I am very mad at this stupid thing.. somehow I managed to hit the back button just before submitting ...

  1. #646
    Geek. Cobras2's Avatar
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    Again I am very mad at this stupid thing.. somehow I managed to hit the back button just before submitting my message, and it was lost forever.
    I'll try to sum up some of what I had written:

    to Clyde:
    Man, I think you have just a little bit too much pride in your "Ability to think things out for yourself". Also, I think you might want to check your ears (hehe.. okay then, eyes..) because you didn't read what I wrote. I said, that I *was beggining to think* that you were one of those who didn't think for himself. Note that I *DID NOT SAY that you don't think for yourself!!!!!*
    (that's what I would call making snap decisions, being offended easily, and generally opening your mouth b4 you think about it.. yes I may have been a little rude.. but your comments were uncalled for.)

    to Solidarity:
    Yes, unfortunately, it does seem that alot of churches these days (and all through history for that matter) claim to hold the bible as truth, and yet treat it as just some kind of guideline, not to be taken seriously or anything.
    I also agree that, if you simply cannot find any faithful churches, it is probably much better to not attend those other (unfaithful) churches; however I'm sure it would be a good idea to try your best to find a faithful church

    to joshdic:
    did you read that article? just wondering as you didn't comment..



    That's all for now; I really am too busy to be writing this at the moment (especially since I lost my long post... grrr.. )
    James G. Flewelling
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  2. #647
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    Fine, that means that catholicism does NOT view the bible as a literal account of historical events.
    Where are you drawing this from? You consistently
    maintain that the bible says the age of the earth is
    6000 years which is untrue. Also
    for example the story of Noah's ark probably would have came to
    Moses through a dream or a vision. And like dreams
    some of it is metaphorical. But what you are trying to say
    is that it is unliteral and therefore false. The physical body, the church, christ body are all refered to as a vessel. I think this
    expresses the meaning of the passage. As I said before
    the bible is not a history book.

  3. #648
    The Earth is not flat. Clyde's Avatar
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    "Where are you drawing this from?"

    Their stance on creationism.

    "You consistently
    maintain that the bible says the age of the earth is
    6000 years which is untrue"

    Then why do creationists believe that is the age of the earth?

    "Also
    for example the story of Noah's ark probably would have came to
    Moses through a dream or a vision"

    Care to back up that up by quoting the bible?

    "And like dreams
    some of it is metaphorical"

    Thats my point, the catholic church sees the bible as metaphorical not literal.

    "But what you are trying to say
    is that it is unliteral and therefore false"

    I'm not saying its false (well actually yes i am, but not right here) all i'm saying is that the catholic church acknowledges that the bible is not a literal account of events.

  4. #649
    The Earth is not flat. Clyde's Avatar
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    "Man, I think you have just a little bit too much pride in your "Ability to think things out for yourself". "

    Oh i'm proud, arrogant, egotistical, but my arrogance and pride is well founded.

    "because you didn't read what I wrote. I said, that I *was beggining to think* that you were one of those who didn't think for himself"

    Indeed and you were concluding that based on my opinions, which run counter your own, thing is that you are the one who has been handed what to believe on a plate, taught not to question, you have opinions that are completely contrary to everything we know about the world.

    I suggest you do some thinking, there is no possible way that he universe is only 6000 years old.

  5. #650
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    >>somehow I managed to hit the back button just before submitting my message, and it was lost forever.

    You do realise that directly opposing your browsers back button, there is a nifty little thing called a 'forward button'? Also, the back button on any browser I have seen to date, appears very disimular to the 'Submit Reply' button on the bottom of the reply page. No need to lose your posts from now on in then.

    ... Uhh... Carry on...

    P.S. I hope everyone is reading these links that Clyde is supplying. I've checked some of them out myself, as its always nice to have additional references. They're quite accurate and specific.
    "There's always another way"
    -lightatdawn (lightatdawn.cprogramming.com)

  6. #651
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    oh my god how can you talk about god so much, god dammit people god doesn't talk about himself this much, if i was admin i'd close down this thread and send all your asses straight to damnation! But that's just me *turns around, gets tail stuck in door as walking out of the room*

  7. #652
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    Originally posted by lightatdawn

    P.S. I hope everyone is reading these links that Clyde is supplying. I've checked some of them out myself, as its always nice to have additional references. They're quite accurate and specific.
    Good god, man! It takes enough time just to read these posts and shake my head while muttering "Why, why?". There's no time to check out Clyde's links, and to be fair, I'd have to check out the nut's links as well. I've got kids, a wife, a job, school. Enough is enough!
    Truth is a malleable commodity - Dick Cheney

  8. #653
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    "You consistently
    maintain that the bible says the age of the earth is
    6000 years which is untrue"

    Then why do creationists believe that is the age of the earth?
    Guesses made on the family lines in the bible.

    Thats my point, the catholic church sees the bible as metaphorical not literal.
    How to get from viewing a few events metaphically to
    there not being a god?

  9. #654
    Senior Member joshdick's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Cobras2
    to joshdic:
    did you read that article? just wondering as you didn't comment..
    First of all, my screen name is joshdick, not joshdic. You keep messing that up and it's kind of annoying me. And just in case you religous types are offended by my screen name, rest assured that it isn't what your dirty minds think it to be. joshdick are the first four and last four letters of my full name.

    Now, on to your question. Yes, I read the article. No, I don't buy into it. Regardless, I still think it'd be much cooler for the Bible to have Pi to a few dozen decimal places.
    FAQ

    "The computer programmer is a creator of universes for which he alone is responsible. Universes of virtually unlimited complexity can be created in the form of computer programs." -- Joseph Weizenbaum.

    "If you cannot grok the overall structure of a program while taking a shower, you are not ready to code it." -- Richard Pattis.

  10. #655
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    Now, on to your question. Yes, I read the article. No, I don't buy into it. Regardless, I still think it'd be much cooler for the Bible to have Pi to a few dozen decimal places.
    It's not like they had the ability to craft stuft past 1/32 of
    an inch.

  11. #656
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    I dont have time to catch up with this thread!

    Well, it was a pretty sorry excuse for a school (thus I dropped out) and the teacher was one of those teacher-students, which explains the bad temper possibly. Problem was, the book spoke of the Piltdown man being true and when I pointed it out the teacher directed me politely towards the door. I was never rude to him, hell I even gave him a cookie!

    I just think that if your going to be teaching the evolutionary practice at a school it should atleast be done with a recent book since it seems to keep changing.

    And in regards to someone who somewhere on one of my posts asked 'what is the right faith'.. Personally Ive spoken to people of different Christian models, not all of them.. there are loads! And Ive been in touch with buddhists but the people I was with literally said 'worship Buddha', Im guessing there was just something wrong with the people I was with cause when I read all the various words of wisdom he had (and they were pretty wise as a matter of fact) it said he was not to be worshipped he was not a god of any kind. From what I could tell by that he set up guidelines to how to live an honourable life during hard times. I respect it and everything, but that doesnt mean Im gonna praise him.

    Muslims I couldnt really get in touch with, cause (atleast from what some friends said) their leader type guy had told them not to be in touch with me or take me to their meetings... *jinkies* So that kindof put me off.

    Most different types of Christianity had a base I could relate with, the word 'spoke' to me and I felt good when I was in it and with Christian friends. (aka. I dropped drugs and wasnt depressed anymore)

    Problem was, all the churches I visit have all these integrity problems, any visit speakers are overviewed by the leadership and they have to make sure were allowed to hear what they say. The first years after the development of the church everything was fine and how it should be, but after awhile, the church seemed to start excommunicating people who wanted to go elsewhere to start something. All aspects of the members lives started getting controlled by the leaders, they had meetings every day and completely disregarded of the outside world.

    Obviously, I got away from the church and back to 'normal'. I questioned the existance of a god and decided Id best just skip all religion. My life got back to where it was and I got depressed all over again (hoorah). After having been feeling that great for so long it just felt worse and worse all the time, and I wanted to do something about it.

    Therefore, now I live by what the word says, Im not part of any church except for when I drop in somewhere for just a meeting. (This causing me not to know if they have problems, and also not to CARE!) It doesnt say anywhere that Ive noticed in the bible that I NEED to be a part of a church,
    so Im sticking to this.


    Ive gotten a tighter schedule (EVEN tighter) now so Im not trying to place up anything thats gonna get me loads of questions here. Its my belief, I stand by it and all what not. I'll be in here, but Im probably not gonna be able to make long posts. Have alotta work to do, and considering that Im gonna have a few weeks leave (going to the US, wheeee!) just after new years, I have to make sure to be slightly ahead of schedule up until then.

    Also, since I havent read the past 400 some posts I feel a little out of place just jumping in, and its probably irritating for you as well since I may be bringing up things youve already discussed. I just wanted some clarity on different sides.

    Have a good'n!

  12. #657
    The Earth is not flat. Clyde's Avatar
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    Guesses made on the family lines in the bible. "

    Just guesses eh? Why is it then that they are so certain of these mere 'guesses'?

    "How to get from viewing a few events metaphically to
    there not being a god?"

    ........ they are somewhat unrelated points, I was trying to point out that catholicism is anti-creationist yet you seem to be sympathetic to the creationist nonsense.

    There is no evidence for God and everything about the universe points away from him. Not only that but there are multiple contradictions between the God described in the bible and the real world, (like how the world/life is anything but perfect) and there are real psychological/anthropological reasons explaining why religions and religous beliefs exist.

    That is why there is no God.

    Incidently how can it be that you take parts of the bible metaphorically and parts literally?

    Why exactly is it that you take Noah's flood to be a metaphor and yet Jesus' ressurection to be literal?

    Catholicism's acceptance of the metaphorical bible (atleast in part) is an example of science/education pushing back religion, making religious beliefs more and more vague and less and less powerfull.
    Last edited by Clyde; 12-17-2002 at 06:53 AM.

  13. #658
    The Earth is not flat. Clyde's Avatar
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    "Problem was, the book spoke of the Piltdown man being true and when I pointed it out the teacher directed me politely towards the door"

    You will have to enlighten me, what is the Piltdown man?

    "I just think that if your going to be teaching the evolutionary practice at a school it should atleast be done with a recent book since it seems to keep changing"

    Scientific fields are in constant flux; new evidence arrives, old evidence is seen in a new light, it is a great strength to be able to constantly re-evaluate your position, it is what makes science so powerfull.

    "My life got back to where it was and I got depressed all over again (hoorah)."

    Life without God does not have to be depressing! It's just that if you start out with a religious view point then what you place value in can run away from you as you move away from religion, it is simply a matter of placing value in different things.

    I'm glad you are not depressed but i query whether religion was the answer, or even the true cause.
    Last edited by Clyde; 12-17-2002 at 06:52 AM.

  14. #659
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    Well, one of my philosophies is: 'Do what makes ya feel good'

    And, if this makes me feel good... thats what I'll do!
    Trust me, Ive felt good without religion a whole lot too, its not like I live my life as a mental shutin and try to stay away from anybody who could disagree with my view on life.

    Ive probably gotten it wrong again... for getting topgrades in english I sure dont show it sometimes. (For that matter, good english grades in Sweden is a fairly simple accomplishment)

    Its one of those extremely old scientific frauds from 1912 (was discovered false in 1954.. somewhere around that) by Charles Dawson. A missing link thing between humans and apes. :P

    Now if you'll excuse me, I have to rewrite these interviews!

  15. #660
    Geek. Cobras2's Avatar
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    >You do realise that directly opposing your browsers back
    >button, there is a nifty little thing called a 'forward button'? Also,
    >the back button on any browser I have seen to date, appears
    >very disimular to the 'Submit Reply' button on the bottom of the
    >reply page. No need to lose your posts from now on in then.

    lol... hehe.. also of course you'll notice that if you hit the back button while writing a post, and then hit thwe forward button, due to the dynamic nature of CGI, it erases your message and starts over again. (And yes, I learned that from experience, lol..)
    Besides im not sure exactly how I did it, because I definately did not click the back button itself - I think I might have hit backspace while the edit window was not active (If I lost you, try it, it seems that backspace is a shortcut key for the back button or something in I.E. [i know.. ie sucks.. but i havent got around to using anything lese ])


    to Clyde:

    >Oh i'm proud, arrogant, egotistical, but my arrogance and pride is well founded.

    I rest my case

    >Indeed and you were concluding that based on my opinions,
    >which run counter your own, thing is that you are the one who
    >has been handed what to believe on a plate, taught not to
    >question, you have opinions that are completely contrary to
    >everything we know about the world.

    No .. I was concluding that because your words match exactly with pretty much every other evolutionist I have ever talked to. The same arguments.. just with a couple prettier words. Now of course, you are going to say "Well.. maybe they're the same cause we're right!" However, strength in numbers does not apply to who is truly correct; it applies to who can make everyone else think they are correct.

    >I suggest you do some thinking, there is no possible way that
    >he universe is only 6000 years old.

    Theere is no way it's older. I have done alot of thinking. I've even studied it a fair bit. And nothing makes as much sense as what it says in the bible. Twist it as you may; make things mroe complicated than they are; evolution just doesn't work, and besides, it's a belief, not science.


    To joshdick:

    >First of all, my screen name is joshdick, not joshdic. You keep
    >messing that up and it's kind of annoying me. And just in case
    >you religous types are offended by my screen name, rest
    >assured that it isn't what your dirty minds think it to be. joshdick
    >are the first four and last four letters of my full name.

    Alright, I'm sorry; you're right, I judged you too quickly - I shouldn't have done that. Unfortunately it seems that there are many many people out there on the internet who come up with dirty names because they think it's fun. I'm sorry for thinking you were one of them without good reason.

    To salvelinus:

    >There's no time to check out Clyde's links, and to be fair, I'd
    >have to check out the nut's links as well.

    Umm lol.. you don't think Clyde is a religious nut too? He is.. his religion is commonly known as "Evolution", or, as Charles Darwin called it,
    "On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection, or the Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle for Life." - see http://www.literature.org/authors/da.../preface.html,
    or, as Satan said, "you will be like God" - see the Bible, Genesis 3:5.
    According to the theory of evolution.. we're getting there! Don't worry, we don't need God.. someday we'll evolve and be just as good as he is! And we'll do it all by ourselves! We have a good reason to think that our pride, arrogance, egos, and arrogance and pride is well founded. (see Clyde - http://cboard.cprogramming.com/showt...369#post210369(have to scroll up a bit))
    James G. Flewelling
    Rgistered Linux User #327359
    Athabasca University Student (BSc. CIS)

    http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
    http://catb.org/jargon/

    http://www.ebb.org/ungeek
    ---GEEK CODE---
    Version: 3.12
    GCS/IT/M d- s+:++ a-->->>+>++>+++>? C++++>$ UL++>++++$ P++>++++ L++>++++$
    E W++ N o? K? w++(--)>--- O? M? V? PS--(---) PE Y+ PGP? t 5? !X R(*)>++
    tv-->! b++(+++)>++++ DI? D+++(---)>++++$ G e*>++$ h++>*$ r!>+++ y?
    ----/GEEK CODE----
    upd: 2005-02-11

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