View Poll Results: do you believe in aliens(extra terrestrials)?

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  • yes

    32 76.19%
  • no

    7 16.67%
  • undecided

    3 7.14%

Do you believe in aliens(extra terrestrials)?

This is a discussion on Do you believe in aliens(extra terrestrials)? within the A Brief History of Cprogramming.com forums, part of the Community Boards category; In my case if I was outside the Universe I would be inside the Universe. In your case if I ...

  1. #46
    Banned ಠ_ಠ's Avatar
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    In my case if I was outside the Universe I would be inside the Universe.
    In your case if I was outside the Multiverse I wouldn't exist
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  2. #47
    C++ Witch laserlight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ಠ_ಠ
    In my case if I was outside the Universe I would be inside the Universe.
    In my opinion, that amounts to saying that you cannot be outside of the universe.

    Quote Originally Posted by ಠ_ಠ
    In your case if I was outside the Multiverse I wouldn't exist
    In other words, you cannot be outside the multiverse.
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  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by laserlight View Post
    In my opinion, that amounts to saying that you cannot be outside of the universe.
    I think of it as saying: The Universe includes everything, even nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by laserlight View Post
    In other words, you cannot be outside the multiverse.
    no, If you go outside your multiverse you cease to exist
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  4. #49
    Devil's Advocate SlyMaelstrom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ಠ_ಠ View Post
    no, If you go outside your multiverse you cease to exist
    Are we having fun with buzz-words?
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  5. #50
    C++ Witch laserlight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ಠ_ಠ
    I think of it as saying: The Universe includes everything, even nothing
    Ah, that interpretation seems more reasonable to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by ಠ_ಠ
    no, If you go outside your multiverse you cease to exist
    Originally, I replied that that was not my intended interpretation. However, in retrospect, that is consistent with the statement that you cannot be outside of the multiverse, so the only thing I now object to your objection is the "no".
    Last edited by laserlight; 03-05-2009 at 11:23 AM.
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  6. #51
    Devil's Advocate SlyMaelstrom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by laserlight View Post
    so the only thing I now object to your objection is the "no".
    The comma, too. Don't forget the comma. It's firey.
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  7. #52
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    Just a few points in order to keep the discussion going:

    - although the speed of light may not be the maximum speed possible (maybe Einstein was having a bad day), I'm pretty convinced that there has to be some upper bound for the exchange of information, because otherwise it wouldn't be possible to tell cause from effect, which is generally considered to be a good thing.
    - if current physics is wrong, then this would be a big surprise. Maybe this will happen some time, but the alternative has to be much better than the current theories. Up to that point, I stick with the current stuff.
    - if there are aliens, then they are far away (> 4 lightyears, because that's the distance from here to the next star). This means that communication is fairly hard, because a simple ping reply takes 8 years. We are not even able to build a machine that stays online that long. If they are in another galaxy, the aliens are probably extinct when they get our reply.
    - if aliens come to visit us, this means that they are probably a lot smarter than us, because they managed to get here before we even knew that they exist.
    - there are a lot of preconditions for a planet to be able to develop life:
    * needs proper distance from its star
    * needs rotation (not too fast (life needs recovery or lots of energy), not too slow (weather...))
    * needs to be far away from areas with lots of mass (supernovae...)
    * needs a moon to stabilize its axis
    * needs a magnetic field to keep away bad things of all sorts
    * needs to have an atmosphere
    * which is not toxic
    * but the planet may not entirely consist out of gas
    * needs to feature many different elements (and not too much of the heavier ones)
    * its star may not be too large (burns too fast) or too small (doesn't emit enough energy)
    * must feature water (or some substitute) and carbon (or some substitute)
    * and must feature temperatures which keeps these things fluid and solid respectively
    * all of the time
    - for aliens to be able to communicate with us, they need a brain (remember things), common sense (remember useful things), hands (make use of the stuff remembered), and the ability to move (tell someone else)

    In other words, the alien guys are just like us.

    That being said, I don't think there are other civilizations out there. If there are, we probably can't talk to them in realtime. We may not be able to go there (there's not enough energy in our solar system to reach the speed of light with a ship that is equipped with people and food for thousands of years). But this doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

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    Greets,
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    Last edited by Snafuist; 03-05-2009 at 12:39 PM.
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  8. #53
    Hail to the king, baby. Akkernight's Avatar
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    What if these aliens need none of those things o.O
    Maybe their bodies produce it all, or don't need any of it :O
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  9. #54
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    > - there are a lot of preconditions for a planet to be able to develop life:
    > * needs proper distance from its star

    Either that or it has to have a lot of geothermal energy like the moon IO does.

    > * needs rotation (not too fast (life needs recovery or lots of energy), not too slow (weather...))

    Unless it's far enough from the sun that the temperature on the sunny side doesn't get too hot (or has geothermal energy).

    > * needs to be far away from areas with lots of mass (supernovae...)

    Please explain a bit more. I think I know what you mean, but it's not totally clear.

    > * needs a moon to stabilize its axis

    I doubt that's a requirement. If it is, it's definitely news to me.

    > * needs a magnetic field to keep away bad things of all sorts

    or the aliens live underground or have evolved to be immune to radiation.

    > * needs to have an atmosphere

    Unless it's a civilization of androids that killed off all their makers.

    > * which is not toxic

    toxic is a relative thing. Just because it's toxic to us, doesn't mean it's toxic to a silicon based organism.

    > * but the planet may not entirely consist out of gas

    Like Jupiter? Probably true. It would need too much mass to stay together if it's all gas.

    > * needs to feature many different elements (and not too much of the heavier ones)

    Debatable. Obviously it can't be make entirely of just a few elements.

    > * its star may not be too large (burns too fast) or too small (doesn't emit enough energy)

    Unless it has a lot of geothermal energy.

    > * must feature water (or some substitute) and carbon (or some substitute)

    That could mean just about anything, so sure...

    > * and must feature temperatures which keeps these things fluid and solid respectively
    > * all of the time

    Our planet doesn't -- water is solid in the winter and liquid in the summer.

    > - for aliens to be able to communicate with us, they need a brain (remember things), common sense (remember useful things), hands (make use of the stuff remembered), and the ability to move (tell someone else)

    Brain - yes.
    Hands - Well it would make things much easier, but as long as they have something (hooves, tentacles...) that they can build things with, they should be fine.
    "I am probably the laziest programmer on the planet, a fact with which anyone who has ever seen my code will agree." - esbo, 11/15/2008

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  10. #55
    spurious conceit MK27's Avatar
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    I am just happy I finally got my surface normals to work in openGL-- you know, for the lighting.

    On another tangent regarding the Great Magnetic Field: the polarity of the earth is due to reverse soon, so don't go spending too much on a compass or you will find yourself in the exact opposite place of where you meant to be.

    I think Snafuist has been suckered, which is a shame because the program itself needs more better programmers
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  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK27 View Post
    don't go spending too much on a compass or you will find yourself in the exact opposite place of where you meant to be.
    or just change which side is painted red
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  12. #57
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    I wonder, we know that we exist here and call ourselves intelligent. But if we didn't have us how probable would the existence of intelligence seem in the Universe (to a "non-intelligent" observer, e.g a god that in no way interferes otherwise with this Universe)?

    We could have been knocked out before evolving intelligence (and it can still happen). What would the estimates look like if we didn't have us and our planet to rely on as an example that definitely has intelligence?

    Or, can we conclude based on a single observance (ourselves), that intelligence as we know it is a physical necessity that must evolve given self-replication of molecules, suitable conditions and sufficient time? Or could we be a one-time anomaly?

    Or, aren't there an infinite number of ways how our intelligence could have developed (and industrial and infotechnological revolution being just one)? Physics (modern science) in a way applies universally, but then it could be argued to be just an abstraction - one possible intelligent attitude towards the surroundings out of infinite possibilities? Aren't there infinite development paths that intelligence could take which would never lead to the idea and possibility to leave the planet? (Why would any intelligent race really want to do that?)
    I might be wrong.

    Thank you, anon. You sure know how to recognize different types of trees from quite a long way away.
    Quoted more than 1000 times (I hope).

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by laserlight View Post
    I now object to ... "no".
    No, you object to the comma
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  14. #59
    Hail to the king, baby. Akkernight's Avatar
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    Why do they have to have intelligence? Maybe they have something, which we can't think of, since humans can't invent new stuff, like a new color or whatever xP
    Maybe they just have the skillz to make computers, UFO's and radios that go to earth, but have no idea what they're doing, or saying into the radio :O which would explain the strange noises aliens make in movies xP
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  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Akkernight View Post
    in movies
    ಠ_ಠ
    ...
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