View Poll Results: do you believe in aliens(extra terrestrials)?

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Do you believe in aliens(extra terrestrials)?

This is a discussion on Do you believe in aliens(extra terrestrials)? within the A Brief History of Cprogramming.com forums, part of the Community Boards category; Originally Posted by maxorator Time is a sequence of events. That means it doesn't exist, therefore it cannot be distorted, ...

  1. #16
    spurious conceit MK27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxorator View Post
    Time is a sequence of events. That means it doesn't exist, therefore it cannot be distorted, destroyed, removed, altered, bended. If universe would collapse, events would still be occuring - the collapsing itself is an event that proves that time exists. And even if no matter is left, the absence of events is still an event that proves time still exists. Maybe that matter neutralizes and lacks from existing, turns into a small ball or jumps to an alien parallel universe. It doesn't make a difference. No matter to fill the 3D doesn't mean the 3D doesn't exist. I can make a DirectX application with no objects and a simple black background and still call it a 3D game, because the game engine is still 3D.

    If time didn't exist before the big bang, the big bang couldn't have occured because there could be no events if the time doesn't exist. Noone or nothing to witness time passing by doesn't instantly mean it's not there.
    That is a philosophy. Altho it makes good sense, I would bet you a million dollars most contemporary physicists would say you are flat out wrong, and it wouldn't be hard to come up with a different philosophy than this (ie, logically you cannot really prove this one is the one).

    Sort of pursuant to this, I was watching Carl Sagan's COSMOS series again a little while ago, and at a certain point he noted that because of relativity, if you left the earth (which is near the rim of the galaxy) on a ship which travelled near (but obviously not at) the speed of light intending to cross the galaxy, this would take hundreds of millions of years earth time because the galaxy is hundreds millions of light-years across.

    But, because of relativity, the amount of time that passed on the ship (whose independent mass is infinitisimal) could be as little as 57 years!!! To the other side of the galaxy!!!

    They are already here for chrissakes!!! Haha -- seriously tho, only a machine could travel that fast, I think the biology inside will suffer.

    ps. I actually saw an article somewhere about God's 3D game engine and it wasn't DirectX...having voted all 16 times now, I think everyone should just give up and acknowledge this chaos.
    Last edited by MK27; 03-04-2009 at 12:35 PM.
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  2. #17
    The larch
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    Does it have any practical consequences, whether they are or aren't there? (I guess if you do believe them, you'll probably keep an eye on the sky...)

    And even if no matter is left, the absence of events is still an event that proves time still exists.
    That is actually quite interesting. Can you really say time passes if there is a complete lack of events. I suppose that you see this passing as an event itself, but it would be in no way observable or measurable (presence of observer would be an event) - an absolutely boring event if an event in the first place.
    I might be wrong.

    Thank you, anon. You sure know how to recognize different types of trees from quite a long way away.
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  3. #18
    Captain Crash brewbuck's Avatar
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    I don't get the question. Why is it necessary to "believe" in aliens? We're not talking about a Supreme Being, whose existence cannot be proved or disproved. Either aliens exist or they don't, and my "belief" in the matter is irrelevant.

    It's like asking, "Do you believe in somebody named Terry Finch who lives in Calgary?" Either Terry Finch exists or he doesn't.

    Do I think it is likely that extra terrestrial life exists? Yes.
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  4. #19
    Devil's Advocate SlyMaelstrom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brewbuck View Post
    I don't get the question. Why is it necessary to "believe" in aliens? We're not talking about a Supreme Being, whose existence cannot be proved or disproved. Either aliens exist or they don't, and my "belief" in the matter is irrelevant.

    It's like asking, "Do you believe in somebody named Terry Finch who lives in Calgary?" Either Terry Finch exists or he doesn't.

    Do I think it is likely that extra terrestrial life exists? Yes.
    The OP is simply asking if you believe that aliens exist. We can't all be from Portland, Oregon, the proper English speaking capital of the universe. Sheesh...
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  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxorator View Post
    Time is a sequence of events. That means it doesn't exist, therefore it cannot be distorted, destroyed, removed, altered, bended. If universe would collapse, events would still be occuring - the collapsing itself is an event that proves that time exists. And even if no matter is left, the absence of events is still an event that proves time still exists. Maybe that matter neutralizes and lacks from existing, turns into a small ball or jumps to an alien parallel universe. It doesn't make a difference. No matter to fill the 3D doesn't mean the 3D doesn't exist. I can make a DirectX application with no objects and a simple black background and still call it a 3D game, because the game engine is still 3D.

    If time didn't exist before the big bang, the big bang couldn't have occured because there could be no events if the time doesn't exist. Noone or nothing to witness time passing by doesn't instantly mean it's not there.
    Ah, but you're only thinking 4 dimensionally.
    Time & space exist inside our universe, but what exists "outside" our universe? That's what I'd like to know. Or at the very least, what would happen if you ever got the end edge of the universe and tried to go further? Would you disappear or maybe be instantly transported to the other side of the universe?
    "I am probably the laziest programmer on the planet, a fact with which anyone who has ever seen my code will agree." - esbo, 11/15/2008

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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK27 View Post
    the galaxy is hundreds millions of light-years across.
    Actually our galaxy is only 100,000 light years across.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milky_way
    "I am probably the laziest programmer on the planet, a fact with which anyone who has ever seen my code will agree." - esbo, 11/15/2008

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  7. #22
    Reverse Engineer maxorator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK27 View Post
    But, because of relativity, the amount of time that passed on the ship (whose independent mass is infinitisimal) could be as little as 57 years!!! To the other side of the galaxy!!!
    Not the time passed on the ship, but the time needed to reach the current position of the light that emit from earth at the moment of departure in the current direction. This travelling in the time theory is based on an assumption that:

    TIMEELAPSED = (LIGHTSPEED - AVGSPEED) / LIGHTSPEED * TIMEELAPSEDONEARTH

    (AVGSPEED means the speed to a direction away from earth).

    But this relation is totally irrelevant since it ties time to a human sense. I could tie it to sound, radio waves or whatever else.

    We can already travel sound time. Some people are talking about travelling light time (which is considered impossible). But we cannot travel real time.
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  8. #23
    Registered User whiteflags's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpjust View Post
    Ah, but you're only thinking 4 dimensionally.
    Time & space exist inside our universe, but what exists "outside" our universe? That's what I'd like to know. Or at the very least, what would happen if you ever got the end edge of the universe and tried to go further? Would you disappear or maybe be instantly transported to the other side of the universe?
    That's too much like an overworld map in an rpg...

    My high school science teacher demonstrated that the only thing existing outside the universe is ignorance. In what sense does knowing about the outside of the universe not make it part of our universe?

    Wait that's too much of a brain........, forget about it.

  9. #24
    The larch
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    Time & space exist inside our universe, but what exists "outside" our universe?
    I do hope and pray that the laws of nature make it pretty damn impossible for you or me to get to that point, so that this question would even arise.

    I also hope this applies to whatever is "outside"...
    I might be wrong.

    Thank you, anon. You sure know how to recognize different types of trees from quite a long way away.
    Quoted more than 1000 times (I hope).

  10. #25
    System Novice siavoshkc's Avatar
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    I don't get the question. Why is it necessary to "believe" in aliens? We're not talking about a Supreme Being, whose existence cannot be proved or disproved. Either aliens exist or they don't, and my "belief" in the matter is irrelevant.

    It's like asking, "Do you believe in somebody named Terry Finch who lives in Calgary?" Either Terry Finch exists or he doesn't.
    I agree. It is not something we can decide or not. If I can't prove something exists and also I can't prove it doesn't, I simply don't know if it exists or not. I choosed undecided but I mean "I don't know.".

    [edit] Considering in mind that "believe in" means "you believe that".
    Last edited by siavoshkc; 03-04-2009 at 03:09 PM.
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  11. #26
    spurious conceit MK27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxorator View Post
    Not the time passed on the ship, but the time needed to reach the current position of the light that emit from earth at the moment of departure in the current direction.
    (emphasis mine)

    WHAT???

    The ship will never reach such a point (actually, I think it starts from there). This is gibberish and you, maxorator, have been defined by me as a clown and you should careful consider the repercussions of this.

    @cpjust: Sorry I got the dimensions wrong. Suddenly 100,000 light-years in only 57 local years seems more plausible.
    C programming resources:
    GNU C Function and Macro Index -- glibc reference manual
    The C Book -- nice online learner guide
    Current ISO draft standard
    CCAN -- new CPAN like open source library repository
    3 (different) GNU debugger tutorials: #1 -- #2 -- #3
    cpwiki -- our wiki on sourceforge

  12. #27
    In my head happyclown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MK27 View Post
    ...and you, maxorator, have been defined by me as a clown and you should careful consider the repercussions of this.
    Hey! As a clown I take offence, you insensitive clod!

    Last edited by happyclown; 03-04-2009 at 03:41 PM. Reason: added more smilies - only clowns will understand why
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  13. #28
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    My answer depends on whether or not you include other universes.
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  14. #29
    Hail to the king, baby. Akkernight's Avatar
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    Why do you wonder about that which doesn not affect you / isn't around you? Instead, wonder why yout electrical bill is getting more expensive, or why your wife is complaining, whatever! xP
    My brain pops out of my head, runs into a wall and dies, when I think of something so big, and so empty.. Or atleast it feels like it does xP
    The interesting stuff is on earth! You don't even have sound up in space D: You won't find a girl you like, up in space D: (or guy if you're a girl xP)
    Also, I belive that starwars is going on in another galaxy, Aliens are prepairing for a mass attack on earth and Rambo is ready to save the day
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  15. #30
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    or why your wife is complaining,
    There are some things even a radio telescope will never find out.

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