Oh this one is GOOD!

This is a discussion on Oh this one is GOOD! within the A Brief History of Cprogramming.com forums, part of the Community Boards category; Anybody who has called Tech Support before will LOVE this story. I've always been of the opinion that Microsoft is ...

  1. #1
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    Oh this one is GOOD!

    Anybody who has called Tech Support before will LOVE this story. I've always been of the opinion that Microsoft is decent. They've made some good software, they've made some bad software, etc.. XP fitted perfect with my personal style, and I could pretty much do whatever I needed to do. I still use it at work, and I'm very impressed with how well it has worked for me. I think that's some good software! But then there's the bad software...

    I recently bought a Dell Laptop, and having Vista preinstalled was no extra charge, so I thought "Meh - I'll try it - I can always replace it later". So I get it, and I start having some issues. Nothing huge, just little annoying things. My brother-in-law works for Microsoft, and he's always been a genuine pro-Microsoft guy. So I told him my latest frustration, and I'm like, "I wanna give Windows a chance - I could go google this and get the hacky solution, I could switch to Linux - but I wanna se Microsoft solve my problem!" So he gives me a number that I can call for free tech support. I call, and after being told 3 times that I'm being transferred to a technician, I actually get someone who identifies themselves as a "technician". And of course, he's got that familiar tech-support "accent" (nothing racial - but we all know that when you call tech support that's a good sign that the guy on the other end knows less about the problem than you do).

    He starts off with, "Have you installed any software since you first used Vista", and I say, "of course I have!". "Well, sir, that's going to be a problem." So he asks me to give him control of my desktop - which I didn't like, but I had expected it, so I had removed all my personal files and backed them up elsewhere before hand - after all, I'm giving Microsoft a fair chance, here. I explained that the problem hadn't existed before, but had started after I ran Windows Update over the weekend. So he says, "The problem is your video card". Odd, considering I have the default option on the best-selling laptop right now! But I go with what he says. He instructs me to open my device manager, and tell him what's listed under "display drivers". So I tell him, give him some other specs, and he tells me to delete one of the 2 drivers, which I do. Still have the problem. Restart the computer? Still have the same problem... Delete the other driver? Now hang on... that doesn't sound right! So I confirm. I very clearly enunciated, "You are telling me to check "delete" and then click the button that disables the only display driver on my system, correct? He says, "yes". So I did...

    And the next five minutes were hilarious!

    "Sir, are you seeing anything yet?"

    "Nothing" (at this point I unplugged the ethernet cable - can't see what he's doing on my desktop)

    "That's normal - windows is reconfiguring your drivers"

    "..."

    "Sir, are you seeing anything yet?"

    "Nothing"

    "It should just be 1-2 minutes more while it reinstalls your drivers"

    "..."

    "Sir, are you seeing anything yet?"

    "Nothing"

    "Okay, let's just wait a bit more and we'll see what happens"

    "Sir - my CPU fan is not running, and the "busy" light is blank - my driver's aren't getting reinstalled, are they?"

    "Well why don't we go ahead and restart your computer"

    "Okay - and how do you propose I do that - guess where the buttons are?"

    "We could try that, yes"

    "You know what? I'm gonna go try Ubuntu..."

    So he transferred me to his manager and I got 10 minutes of this, "You see, sir, in India people use Nokia because it's user-friendly, in America they use Motorola because it's user-friendly for them. We're trying to make Windows Vista user-friendly, and with your help, we'll do it right!"

    Ugh... I'm sorry Microsoft - you're losing a fairly loyal fan. Kubuntu is now running with the proper Wifi drivers, and I LOVE IT!

  2. #2
    Woof, woof! zacs7's Avatar
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    Haha, the odd thing is you knew what was going to happen.

    What was the problem anyway?

    Now all you have to do is ditch Ubuntu for a real distro

  3. #3
    C++まいる!Cをこわせ! Elysia's Avatar
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    Microsoft is known to have very, very poor support. Just look at all those horror stories on the web!
    Sorry to hear you had trouble, though. I have been running Vista pretty fine with only one small hickup - that the sound sometimes wants to disappear, but changing sound mode fixes that.

    All in all, I do not think you should exactly blame Vista, but rather Microsoft-pathetic-support
    Quote Originally Posted by Adak View Post
    io.h certainly IS included in some modern compilers. It is no longer part of the standard for C, but it is nevertheless, included in the very latest Pelles C versions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salem View Post
    You mean it's included as a crutch to help ancient programmers limp along without them having to relearn too much.

    Outside of your DOS world, your header file is meaningless.

  4. #4
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    Now all you have to do is ditch Ubuntu for a real distro
    I was using FreeBSD and LOVED it - but after ndisgen'ing the drivers for my card - it still couldn't recognize any networks. Everyone in the community just said, "well - that's it!" I actually really like Kubuntu. REALLY good community, robust, fits my style (edit: KDE in general fits my style - the inner workings of Ubuntu - we'll see, but in all honesty I'm impressed). Updating's a little weird, but I've just never used *nix as my primary system, so it'll take some time. I'll toy with other stuff to see, but I just have to have a good system up and running in the mean time.

    What was the problem anyway?
    Running the console window or any DOS app said, "the system does not support fullscreen mode". Problem is - it did last week! It was also giving me errors any time I edited a file while the command window was open.

    I ended up finding a somewhat hacky solution online for the full-screen issue, but it didn't sound terribly reliable, and it didn't sound exactly like my original problem, so I'm just ditching Vista - I'm done...

    All in all, I do not think you should exactly blame Vista, but rather Microsoft-pathetic-support
    I don't blame Vista. That's like blaming your truck for bad gas mileage. If it's a problem for you, you should stop using it. It's the manufacturer's fault. And if you don't like it, you should stop using it, otherwise it's YOUR fault!

    I do blame Microsoft management in general. They rushed the release, and it seems that my problem with Vista ultimately stems from paradigms used the design. It's got too many safety nets. I'd rather set my own safety nets and do my work. If other people use Vista - I don't discourage them - it's just a style issue. But objectively speaking, I think Microsoft hasn't done a good job here.

    I heard the analogy that Vista is Windows ME 2. Windows 7 is like XP 2. If that be the case - I'm excited for Windows 7. I just hope it doesn't get rushed - but they haven't set a deadline, so I'm optimistic.

  5. #5
    C++まいる!Cをこわせ! Elysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sean View Post
    I don't blame Vista. That's like blaming your truck for bad gas mileage. If it's a problem for you, you should stop using it. It's the manufacturer's fault. And if you don't like it, you should stop using it, otherwise it's YOUR fault!
    Hehehe, sounds like you are somewhat upbeat about this issue.

    I do blame Microsoft management in general. They rushed the release, and it seems that my problem with Vista ultimately stems from paradigms used the design. It's got too many safety nets. I'd rather set my own safety nets and do my work. If other people use Vista - I don't discourage them - it's just a style issue. But objectively speaking, I think Microsoft hasn't done a good job here.

    I heard the analogy that Vista is Windows ME 2. Windows 7 is like XP 2. If that be the case - I'm excited for Windows 7. I just hope it doesn't get rushed - but they haven't set a deadline, so I'm optimistic.
    Indeed it was rushed, and it probably is ME 2.
    Resource hungry, buggy... well, you name it.
    Windows 7 is looking better, though. We are in agreement! Lots of info about Win7 around this time and a public beta should show up soon, as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adak View Post
    io.h certainly IS included in some modern compilers. It is no longer part of the standard for C, but it is nevertheless, included in the very latest Pelles C versions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salem View Post
    You mean it's included as a crutch to help ancient programmers limp along without them having to relearn too much.

    Outside of your DOS world, your header file is meaningless.

  6. #6
    Registered User whiteflags's Avatar
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    Speaking of, I heard that you can pick any family of Windows and not possibly get to seven. This has been tested repeatedly. Not that it matters, but Microsoft versioning system at work!

  7. #7
    Banned master5001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elysia View Post
    Microsoft is known to have very, very poor support. Just look at all those horror stories on the web!
    Sorry to hear you had trouble, though. I have been running Vista pretty fine with only one small hickup - that the sound sometimes wants to disappear, but changing sound mode fixes that.

    All in all, I do not think you should exactly blame Vista, but rather Microsoft-pathetic-support
    Yeah, lets not blame Microsoft for distributing a piece of crap piece of software, lets blame them for being rude because we freak out when their piece of crap software is not working right. Come on now... seriously.

  8. #8
    Registered User whiteflags's Avatar
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    If I knew that I could ship dog crap in a CD case, but it's okay if I had a badass support team, I would.

  9. #9
    Banned master5001's Avatar
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    Microsoft seems to approach things with the mentality of sell it now, fix it later. That is just poor form no matter how you slice it.

  10. #10
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    If I knew that I could ship dog crap in a CD case, but it's okay if I had a badass support team, I would.
    "Yes, sir. It's perfectly normal for the poo to turn white. We'll gladly extend your warranty indefinitely, free of charge, and we'll even ship you new poo. Would you like the nightly-snapshot that's still steaming, or the stable version that's covered in flies and sorta dry?"

    And then if they couldn't fix it over the phone, they'd have to send a poopsmith to help you fix it.

    edit: Oddly, I actually think I would feel more satisfied after that conversation than the one I had with Microsoft today.

  11. #11
    Malum in se abachler's Avatar
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    You shoudl get rid of vista and upgrade to XP They just completey assed up Vista's development, but now they are stuck with it until the next product release. Do yourself a favor and just dont buy it. It's not like noone has ever heard of Vista having problems, at this point if you still insist on tryign it you get what you deserve.
    Until you can build a working general purpose reprogrammable computer out of basic components from radio shack, you are not fit to call yourself a programmer in my presence. This is cwhizard, signing off.

  12. #12
    and the hat of sweating
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    Well I think it must be bad drivers or something.
    I've been using Vista for almost a year and it's running perfectly.
    The only problem I've had is that I'm running the x64 version, and a lot of companies (like Macromedia...) are taking forever to release 64-bit drivers, but I would have had exactly the same problem with x64 XP.
    "I am probably the laziest programmer on the planet, a fact with which anyone who has ever seen my code will agree." - esbo, 11/15/2008

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  13. #13
    C++まいる!Cをこわせ! Elysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by master5001 View Post
    Yeah, lets not blame Microsoft for distributing a piece of crap piece of software, lets blame them for being rude because we freak out when their piece of crap software is not working right. Come on now... seriously.
    Hey, who said it was not bad?
    In this case, it was Microsoft support that screwed up, not Vista. But I am still not aligning with Microsoft and their quality in software and hardware (XBox 360, anyone?).
    Quote Originally Posted by Adak View Post
    io.h certainly IS included in some modern compilers. It is no longer part of the standard for C, but it is nevertheless, included in the very latest Pelles C versions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Salem View Post
    You mean it's included as a crutch to help ancient programmers limp along without them having to relearn too much.

    Outside of your DOS world, your header file is meaningless.

  14. #14
    C++ Witch laserlight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sean
    I heard the analogy that Vista is Windows ME 2. Windows 7 is like XP 2. If that be the case - I'm excited for Windows 7. I just hope it doesn't get rushed - but they haven't set a deadline, so I'm optimistic.
    Yeah, after hearing (hopeful) praise from various sources on Windows 7, I am considering just skipping Windows Vista.
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  15. #15
    pronounced 'fib' FillYourBrain's Avatar
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    Fedora user myself... but I think people's microsoft hate is overblown. Its really not a bad OS. People just like to hate the leader. And it gets attacked from both the highly technical (*nix) side and the fruity, artsy (mac) side. Really, it is a pretty good compromise of a system. As for the technical problems I've seen linux and mac both crash pretty hard too.
    "You are stupid! You are stupid! Oh, and don't forget, you are STUPID!" - Dexter

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