Halt! Who goes there?

This is a discussion on Halt! Who goes there? within the A Brief History of Cprogramming.com forums, part of the Community Boards category; And I am quite sure every country, except USA, has traditions like this one. We have festivals. You might argue ...

  1. #76
    Registered User whiteflags's Avatar
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    And I am quite sure every country, except USA, has traditions like this one.
    We have festivals. You might argue about cultural significance of course, but we have festivals. Chinese New Year, cherry blossom festivals (there's one in Washington DC every year). I'd say probably that food festivals are what defines American culture. We are passionate about the food we eat. Just about everything has a festival somewhere. Around where I live there is a pretty big cherry festival, because Michigan is the largest producer of that fruit in this country.

    We also have customs, though Christian ones tend to dominate now. That's not how it was in the beginning.

    But then America is a country that built itself around being open to and absorbing culture, so it really depends who you are and what you came here for. I won't deny that culture fascinates me, but I'm happy that it doesn't dominate here. That in my opinion encourages astounding prejudice.

  2. #77
    (?<!re)tired Mario F.'s Avatar
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    The web is not that influential in behavior and culture as sometimes we may be lead to think... or told.

    For one, the web is a medium and not an active player. It surely helps "to spread the word", but that's it. Necessarily there are cultures that are born inside this medium. But these cultures aren't that influential, or haven't been so far, because contrary to TV, the web design doesn't broadcast. The person has to actively search for this information and link to it. It's like a TV station with one channel per website.

    The other problem is that the internet use and penetration isn't that high yet. Only 1/5 of the world population uses or has used at least once the internet. Of those, we have to take out anyone not interested in the internet as a social or cultural event, those too old and too young to use be influenced by it, those too poor or too oppressed to be able respond positively to any influence.

    Finally, it will still take some good years before anything can be said about internet social or cultural influence in the world in an objective, factual way. And I'll risk that for the past 20 decades it was close to nil.
    The programmer’s wife tells him: “Run to the store and pick up a loaf of bread. If they have eggs, get a dozen.”
    The programmer comes home with 12 loaves of bread.


    Originally Posted by brewbuck:
    Reimplementing a large system in another language to get a 25% performance boost is nonsense. It would be cheaper to just get a computer which is 25% faster.

  3. #78
    Malum in se abachler's Avatar
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    You need to consider the economic influence of the segments of those societies that it is penetrating as well. In the U.S. it was initially primarily among the afluent and educated, which set the tone for tis development. If it penetrates different parts of society initially in other regions it may set a different tone for its use in those regions, although it is large enough now that the global internet culture will more or less force or at least encourage a more centrist/mainstream view. The very nature of the internet at least encourages some minimal thought, as for the most part it is interactive and the subject must make at least a knee jerk decision, btu still ad ecision at some level, as oposed to the boob tube where the interaction is limited to flipping between a few dozen/hundred channels. There is no effective way to generate yoru own content, so its more or less passive.
    Until you can build a working general purpose reprogrammable computer out of basic components from radio shack, you are not fit to call yourself a programmer in my presence. This is cwhizard, signing off.

  4. #79
    Devil's Advocate SlyMaelstrom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxorator View Post
    You may not have noticed what is going on in other countries. Traditions are extremely important in countries, which have some cultural values. I simply can't believe anyone can be that ignorant to say there's no room for culture or that globalization has simply wiped away cultural values. In Estonia, culture dominates. Globalization is considered a sickness here that threatens to make people care less about culture.

    For example, in Estonia, we have national Song Festivals held since 1869, once in every five years. Last time it was held was in 2004, and 34 000 singers and dancers (1&#37; of Estonian population) performed there, wearing national clothes and singing national songs, and the audience consisted of 200 000 people (15% of Estonian population) and hundreds of thousands of people watched it from the television. If you still think there is no room for cultural domination, then... I don't know what to say. And I am quite sure every country, except USA, has traditions like this one.
    You must not have read beyond the tenth word, because your response is almost unrelated to what you're responding to. My whole post was related to the effect the internet has had on pop-culture, which was a response to the half of Mario's post regarding the pop-culture influence of the USA in the 60, 70, and 80s. Your post was about tradition... and the only truly ignorant statement I've seen in the past few posts was your statement about the USA not having traditions. It's very hypocritical of you to tell me that I don't know what is going on in other countries when you respond the way you do. I've spent two of my twenty-one years on this earth in your continent, where-as I'm not even sure you've even had the opportunity to leave your own country, yet.

    To respond to Mario... I suppose it's just what we've experienced, but from my own, I can still see plenty of US influence in Europe well past the 80s. Let's not forget that my own memory pretty much starts in the 90s and I'd have to say... in my life time, US television, fashion, architecture, even political and economical theories have had a strong influence on Europe. Hell, I was with a girl for a year and a half who was born and grew up in Eastern Europe. I've been to her country with her a few times and I can see the influence with my own eyes in the brands that people wear and the words they use.

    However, this goes both ways... since the popularization of the WWW and even cable television, the US has been significantly more influenced by European culture, fashion, politics, and economics (especially Western Europe). The point I'm trying to make is that they've grown so similar in some ways, that it's difficult to tell where a trend even originated these days. I know the penetration isn't a high percentage... 1/5th seems about right to me, but you can't deny that this is significantly higher than it was 20 years ago, and clearly it has an effect. You don't need every person to see a trend on the internet for it to catch on, you only need one cool person. They wear it and it spreads like wildfire. One-fifth is all the penetration you need.

    Anyway, I accept your opinions fully because I'm sure they come from your own experiences, however... we almost come from different eras, so it's sensible to say that my experiences are different than your own.
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  5. #80
    (?<!re)tired Mario F.'s Avatar
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    I agree. There is still obvious influences of US culture in Europe. Particularly in Eastern and Southern Europe. And this will remain like so. What however I witness is less of a desire to assimilate as it used to be... or better yet, a more critic approach.

    And yes, we do share different experiences and for the most part I honestly have an hard time understanding the current times. I would take your word for it more than I would take my own.
    The programmer’s wife tells him: “Run to the store and pick up a loaf of bread. If they have eggs, get a dozen.”
    The programmer comes home with 12 loaves of bread.


    Originally Posted by brewbuck:
    Reimplementing a large system in another language to get a 25% performance boost is nonsense. It would be cheaper to just get a computer which is 25% faster.

  6. #81
    Devil's Advocate SlyMaelstrom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mario F. View Post
    I agree. There is still obvious influences of US culture in Europe. Particularly in Eastern and Southern Europe. And this will remain like so. What however I witness is less of a desire to assimilate as it used to be... or better yet, a more critic approach.

    And yes, we do share different experiences and for the most part I honestly have an hard time understanding the current times. I would take your word for it more than I would take my own.
    Heh, I think what you're witnessing is another trend that is not new in the USA.

    It's the trend of picking an enemy and pretending to hate it (while still taking in all the good things it offers). There are a ton of reasons to be critical of the USA these days... we're doing silly things with politics and war, out economy is declining, movies have been getting worse, television has been getting worse, we idolize the lazy and even gave them their own title ("socialite")... it's really nothing to be proud of. However, between the mess there is still a lot that the USA is offering the world that they appreciate... but like humans, we always make the bad shine stronger than the good. Anyway... I don't know what to say about it. Globalization and pop culture does a lot of good in the short run and maybe a lot of bad in the long run... only time will tell if we're heading down the right track or the way to destruction.
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  7. #82
    Malum in se abachler's Avatar
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    We will survive, at least until the machiens take over. As long as there is someone standing behind the gun, there will always be someone left to continue the human race. With the machies though, we may be doomed to extinction, but then thats the way of all life, to be replaced by something else, possibly better.
    Until you can build a working general purpose reprogrammable computer out of basic components from radio shack, you are not fit to call yourself a programmer in my presence. This is cwhizard, signing off.

  8. #83
    and the hat of int overfl Salem's Avatar
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    Perhaps they're looking for something?
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  9. #84
    Malum in se abachler's Avatar
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    I doubt they are missing, just 'unaccounted for'. This is typical for equipment used in sensitive operations.
    Until you can build a working general purpose reprogrammable computer out of basic components from radio shack, you are not fit to call yourself a programmer in my presence. This is cwhizard, signing off.

  10. #85
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    such policies from the country that developed computers

  11. #86
    the hat of redundancy hat nvoigt's Avatar
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    From my point of view, searching data is excessive. It is not required for the immediate safety of the other passengers, the flight or the country. Data on my laptop is neither more nor less dangerous than my thoughts.

    Checks at airports make sense for two categories: Check for stuff that is detrimetal to the well-being of people involved (i.e. no C4 on the plane please) AND check for stuff that is a illegal to import (i.e. large quantities of gas or cigarettes without properly paid taxes). A general check is not needed right there and would otherwise need a warrant. Doing it without a warrant is extortion. "We have no right to do so, but strip for us, or else... ". Having the power to do so doesn't make it right.

    Any country can demand whatever they want from people visiting their country. It's their country and their rules, right ? Yeah, sure. You only get in if you leave your privacy at the door ? Fine. You can only get in if you leave an DNA sample ? Fine. You can only get in if you convert to Islam ? Fine, too ? Would you do that ? Convert to Islam the next time you visit the middle east ? Hey, it's their country, right ? Their country, their rules. We said that earlier, when it was our country and our rules. But is that really that easy ?
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  12. #87
    Malum in se abachler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nvoigt View Post
    AND check for stuff that is a illegal to import
    It is illegal to import munitions without authorization. Strong encryption is classified as a munition under international law. Software that impliments strong encryption is therefore a munition. Searching your hard drive for munitions is therefore perfectly legitimate under international law.
    Until you can build a working general purpose reprogrammable computer out of basic components from radio shack, you are not fit to call yourself a programmer in my presence. This is cwhizard, signing off.

  13. #88
    (?<!re)tired Mario F.'s Avatar
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    you gotta be kidding
    The programmer’s wife tells him: “Run to the store and pick up a loaf of bread. If they have eggs, get a dozen.”
    The programmer comes home with 12 loaves of bread.


    Originally Posted by brewbuck:
    Reimplementing a large system in another language to get a 25% performance boost is nonsense. It would be cheaper to just get a computer which is 25% faster.

  14. #89
    Devil's Advocate SlyMaelstrom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by abachler View Post
    It is illegal to import munitions without authorization. Strong encryption is classified as a munition under international law. Software that impliments strong encryption is therefore a munition. Searching your hard drive for munitions is therefore perfectly legitimate under international law.
    But the internet defeats the purpose of this search. The fact is, there is a completely insecure network in and out of the country which all electronic data can be passed through. It's kind of like closing the window when the door is wide open... there's no point to it. The only criminals you could catch are the foolish ones and they are not the ones I'm worried about.

    Anyway, the fact remains that if it happened to me, I wouldn't give two of something dirty about it so long as I make my flight. I'm not embarassed by what's on my computer... certainly no more than what I keep in my other luggage.
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  15. #90
    Malum in se abachler's Avatar
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    Regardless of the effectiveness of alternate means of transport, a search is warranted and legitimate. They search for drugs, and yet the vast majority of drugs are nto smuggled through airports. This doesnt mean they should stop searching for them.
    Until you can build a working general purpose reprogrammable computer out of basic components from radio shack, you are not fit to call yourself a programmer in my presence. This is cwhizard, signing off.

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